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Rejoice Rejoice Rejoice !!!

John K

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Voyager  Best of luck to you on a fantastic voyage ahead  You are in good hands with John’s contacts You can PM me as well if you want to hook up with other like minded people

You have already begun studying Ananda Sutram Continue this and return with any questions

Please pick up a copy of Autobiography of a Yogi by Paramahansa Yogananda

You may be surprised to know that John at one time was an Acharya and then trained in western medicine You might search through the old Cakewalk Coffee House because he has some interesting writings there on several fringe and taboo subjects The impact of his thoughts are evident in the 2001 Space Odyssey mentality reaction  Your 2001 analogy is hilarious. Mine would have been Pearls before Swine but as I dug up and played the DVD opening sequence, I am still laughing my ass off

Diet in yoga is not something critical for a couple years or so There is no demand upon you to give up anything  Just understand the philosophy and hold it in the back of your mind as a place keeper for now

A couple years ago John was doing some kind of ethanol fueled rant on the old forum and mentioned the Essene Gospel of Peace  I thought how funny that in a place like CH someone knew about this

Google for a link where these are all published and read

The teachings are the highest integrity of dietary observances but too hard for the common person to adhere to, myself included

Please read these as well, and for you Voyager, pay close attention to book four because this contains an essence of what you are seeking

My cooking instruction is a more watered down version  It will not be perfect but a good start  Jesus might have said my heart was in the right place but I missed the disciplinary mark trying to pervert you guys to a lower standard

Diet in yoga is based on a couple principles one of which is “Ahimsa” or non injury This presents a problem because we have to kill something else to live You get hungry and can eat a dog or a banana  The banana cells get killed  You eat the dog and the dog gets killed The greatest harm to the universe is in taking the life of a more developed organism doing its thing to get to higher ground and not necessarily volunteering itself for a quick trip inside our gut We are accountable even if we think we are free after the last decaying fart

It so happens that the path of Ahimsa is closely in line with what is more healthy for us Processing of any kind also takes down vitality and health benefits  Christ said in the Essene books that any environmental condition that you would feel uncomfortable interacting with your body also affects the healing properties of the food we eat  Too hot too cold too dead etc  The rabble were confused and asked him how they could cook their bread He introduced the sprouting process, sun baking and the recipe for what is called “Essene Bread” which you can buy commercially or make your own.

One last offering on how yoga classifies dietary elements

There are three major fields of force that mold primordial substance into rock over progressive stages and eons of time They do have English equivalents sort of so can control the urge to speak in tongues and get myself in trouble with JohnG

Sentient force, Mutative force, Static force

Everything around us is bound by the static force although there is what you might call a reflection effect where physical elements can mimic mutative and sentient influence Food substances predominate in one of the three properties and have a profound effect on physical and mental wellbeing

Sentient foods nourish the body and mind to do the best in can under genetics Examples are grains, fruits, vegetables, beans, milk products in moderation and the like

Mutative foods flog the system with energy but it is not a focused mental state  Physical cells are agitated These foods may or may not be harmful to the mind and include coffee, hot spices, chocolate and others

Static foods impart inertia and mental clouding They are bad for both body and mind  Examples are meat, eggs, fish, onion, garlic, intoxicants, alcohol (I am filing for an exemption for my wine but not getting my hopes up)

These classifications are not cut in stone because there are environmental factors that can cause shifts in the way we process  John knows a lot more about these and is welcomed to explain further

I think for me best to take a hike from this discussion because of the ugliness that was predictable from the get go.

If good non cannibal recipes and techniques are not too pagan, I will start a new discussion somewhere up the line

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On 2/15/2019 at 6:26 PM, Voyager said:

John K, got your PM. Thank you for the links to your contacts and sage advice. I owe you big time and will follow through with what you have given.


Voyager, I knew this would happen. John is a good man. Glad your on your way.


On 2/16/2019 at 6:47 PM, Voyager said:

This whole thing is incredible. At my age and infirmity that there is such a beautiful chapter ahead.


It's all about our journey.



On 2/17/2019 at 7:17 PM, Jyotishvarii said:

I think for me best to take a hike from this discussion because of the ugliness that was predictable from the get go

Which is a shame. But all good things must come to an end. Oh well, another time!

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Tried to cook something and it turned to charcoal (again...wife just kicked me out of her kitchen...) You said you will share some good vegetarian secrets. New glorious thread up and coming. Done rejoiced enough here.

I'd like to be first in line to ask about your family's lineage recipes for pickles. Anything you can share?



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Dear John,

I would gladly gather up all my Hindu idol statues, all my tea leaves, all my tarot cards, chicken entrails, magical amulets and dive into the flames of the sacrificial alter for you. You have asked for something though that is impossible to comply with   Ask anything else but not the family guarded recipe for pickles

You of all should know why this is forbidden

If you are near an Asian food store you can pick up Patak brand pickles  If still not satisfied you can PM an address and I will send some jars of what my family has kept in treasured secrecy for thousands of years

Love and kisses,


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Jyoti, I figured that would be your answer given how strict and hardcore the tradition is. Then how about this request? (This got to tug at your heart strings)

Garam Masala (spice combination)

We have a big grocery chain out here where you can get garam masala. It tastes like eggnog spice with hot chili in it. Would make a better insecticide than a cooking spice. I know you must have some good family procedures to make the spice and don’t use garlic.

Can I ask for your formula for garam masala?

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Damn girl... If you were not an advanced yoga adept, you would have made one hell of a good moral orthodox Hindu wife. Hard core to the gills and sticking to your guns.

Lowering my expectations here.

What about a curry mix?  Not as elaborate as garam masala.

Maybe I shouldn't be asking you to divulge your family's curry secret formula either?


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Have mercy on me here. I’ve not met with this much rejection since my high school heart throb ran off over a guy with a Honda 50cc. I only had a bicycle.

I appreciate the reference to Patak brand pickles, however Patak is about like Taco Bell is to real mexican food. Like Pace Picante sauce is like to authentic salsa. And plus, the Mexican women are more generous to share their family recipes (guilt trip aimed directly at Jyotishvarii).

Sometimes when I hit the skids and long for the old country, I cook up a bunch of white rice with a few rocks thrown in to chip my teeth. Open a bottle of Patak, but it is not the same.

Some years ago when I wore the orange robes over there in India, I realized that there was a lot of clout with my position. I was aware of this and never abused it, except for twice.

Two times I asked a saintly matriarch of a couple families to tell me how she made pickles.  I was quickly shut down and had to beg forgiveness for my sin of asking.

To us western guys here, pickles are something thrown on to a worm cadaver flying through a McDonalds drive thu. A properly sophisticated Indian chef would look at American pickles as inedible except for dog food, if we did not risk poisoning the dog. Indian pickles are incredible and meant to be a garnish of a non descript meal of white rice and whatever bland vegetables that could be found in the wild.

The preparation details are complex and a process carried down as a secret from generation to generation.

Anyway, I tried.



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I’m updating a progress report to fuel the fires.

I have no knowledge about high end designer pickles outside Vlasic dills in a glass jar last time I hit up a food store.

I did however get to meet with the Acharya teacher for the Ananda Marga yoga movement on his tour close to Chicago.

I do not even find words to thank you.

I was initiated into “First Lesson”  meditation in the evening and got to hang out with him for a few hours the next day. I mean what starship did you people get off on? The Acharya also gave me remedies to help with my voice damage that seems to be helping already. God almighty, this is incredible. No way I can pay back for instruction on the path to coming home. I did ask about the dollar figure if it was going to hit me. He said that it was free because I had already paid the price. The yoga parlors at 50 dollars a week are only business transactions. I had earned the real thing.

I am interested in the training you had to do to get to this level of knowledge. This Acharya is some kind of combination of a Seer, saint, chiropractor, healer and other things I cannot understand as of yet.

I mean, be blessed. Such a whacked out discussion on a banal everyday blog that has unearthed diamonds.

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Big celebration for you. Your path ahead is strewn with the diamonds you mentioned.

Be aware however that you will experience a “honeymoon” period crashing down to several months up to a couple years of hell before you can crawl to the surface of what you are seeking. Ancient heathens called what you are headed into as “Yatamana”, a period of trial and difficulty. Everything you know, everything you think has to be obliterated before Freedom can be touched upon. Your only recourse for your survival is to be absolutely strict on applying the instructions given to you by your Acharya, no matter what seems to be happening. I estimate you got a month before the real work begins.

About “First Lesson”. This was a major thumbs up from your Acharya. Usually the saint would have diagnosed two intro levels of practice to start you on. Idea is to let you percolate in positive trauma twice a day for a few years until certain genetic and hormonal changes were inflicted enough to allow you the nerve connections to withstand First Lesson. Objective is to get you high, not burn you to a crisp.

Like you, I was a high achiever and only had to keep the two preliminary lessons for a year and a half before being granted First Lesson. Something special about you that you moved to the head of the class.

Regarding training required for an “Acharya”. It is more in the integrity of mind, evolution of the heart, spiritual longing, balance of all these things that allowed us through the pipeline to train to something none of us really deserved. My class from the west had 9 persons who had made the bar from Canada to the south pole.

I had to do a couple years practice on my own to establish discipline.

Then off to Denver USA for a couple years for intensified training. Got my “certificate” as a teacher on a generic level.

Then to “LFT” training. Means shit to a tree for anyone around here, but 3 months intensive. 18 hours a day and got first my LPT degree and then LFT degree.

Admission to school with the big guys was contingent on how well I could put what I had learned into practical application. Taught yoga in three Canadian prisons for three months. Vegetarian cooking classes, meditation classes full blast when I was not commuting between the prisons. Reviews were positive enough that I was accepted for the next step of my odyssey.

Off to Sweden in a remote forest for a hard year of training and discipline. 18 hours a day, seven days a week, no breaks or holidays. Severe swami guru stuff. Got my “Tatvika” degree, means one who has achieved clairvoyant interface with the causal matrix. Not that I could understand our Origin in completeness, but had the grace to realize that It was there. Was able to differentiate the most rudimentary vibrations of a human carbon form and adjust their bio electric complexity to get clean of distortions taking them to physical death in ignorance. Learned a lot about naturopathic and yogic medicine and physical manipulation, healing for the physical structure.

Advanced there to get my “brcii” cert. Then able to diagnose and impart lessons like you received.

Off to Benares for more training in India, though I didn’t really learn anything more. Just how to deal with malaria and dysentery and parasites and still keep strength of focus in the intent of service.

Done did that and was sent to Midnapoor for field training. Sick as a forking dog but must have passed the next level of torture even if I don’t remember much of the experience. Except for almost being eaten alive by 3 foot wide spiders there in the jungle. Still have occasional nightmares about that.

Was not much left of me but finally bestowed the title of Acharya. Sent then to many places in the world to teach.

Did this for some time but bailed out because I never embraced the idea that I deserved the robes I wore. Just a retired beer drinking space out now, and more than at peace with that.


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Frigging awesome and this gives me a glimpse of what is behind the guy who taught me.

At this point, there is some increasing mental disturbance and my dream life is going crazy. I don’t know if this is part of what is supposed to be happening. Concentration is next to impossible and I don’t know if I am just failing or too weak. They never taught us anything like this in high school.

Now that I have wasted an entire life, do you have any thoughts on how to make up for lost time. I am beginning to realize a hard hard uphill climb and not a lot of time left to get to the top.

Of lesser gravity, what is this flame war with you and the young lady over pickles all about? What else have I missed out in this life?

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This is great news that you are experiencing troubles so soon.

Impressions in subconscious and unconscious mind have to be driven to the surface to get free of their distortions.

Analogy for the common man would be to arrive here on earth as usual. Somewhere between the burger meal and having to pick up the kids, there is a slight fraction of a second where something higher tries to filter down, but is quickly buried and blocked by our safety net. The filter needed to continue with life as Trump and Brittany Spears say we need to be. No need to seek more with the collective “norm” and our temporal gods and politicians telling us we are okay. Forget that inner voice. Nobody else listens, why should you. Snoop Doggy Dog doesn’t.

The vantage point from outside in is like looking down into a pool of murky, stagnant water. Current apes can only thus introspect to a limited extent until vision is lost and focus spring load protective returns to the hi amplitude turmoil of the waking state, agitating and causing grief to the mind, but familiar ground. Death bound in the flash of an eye, but safe and temporarily comfortable on the way down and out.

You are undergoing a cleansing process which sounds like it is kicking into gear quickly.

Dream and waking state augmentation is because the crap keeping you back is being worked out and exhausted so you can see clearly. Purge the dirt and debris out of the water and you will soon be able to see into the depth.

Subjective feeling of lack of concentration is a paradox you got to understand. You try to do an otherwise simple concentration process and are blown off the mark. Why can’t I concentrate. Why can’t I do this.

The purge going on and inability to retain focus are the first signs of success. Your Acharya hit the mark as to what you need.

Making up for lost time is met by total immersion. I assume the Acharya told you to maintain the process for an hour a day, two 30 minute sessions.

Dive in with three, with four sessions, each longer than 30 minutes. Take up all the peripheral practices as much as you can tolerate. At about age 80, glands and nerve response are pretty much shot, not that any effort is wasted even then. If I interpret right you are around 55 years of age. You still got time although you have realized that you got a lot of catch up to do.

Uh… about the pickle flame war with Jyoti…

This is something that will bring tears to the eyes to anyone with a heart. Can explain this tragedy more once I can stop sobbing over it.


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John thank you.

I don’t want to seem like a baby crying to mama but strange things are happening.

I am doing the practice and it is like my head and legs are cut off or stretched 50 feet. My body is getting mangled out of proportion. This distortion goes away after I stop the procedure, but there are bad pressures in the head and over the body, things that are not comfortable in the works. Please help. Should I stop this for now?

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Hang in there but under circumstances limit the daily effort to the two sessions until your nervous system can adapt. What you are experiencing with pressures and spatial distortions is a normal growing pain, but hitting you way more quick than for most. If this were an omen, you are so fortunate.

If the Acharya advised “asanas”, the stretching type exercises, make sure you follow the instruction as well. We are born with a parallel connection with mind and body. In a way simplified construct, it is the lack of physical and mental parallelism that eventually precipitates death. You are radically changing the mental wavelength from what you were born with on the ascension toward Knowledge. Physical bodies try to adjust but lag behind rapid mental evolution. Mind and body no longer match up. Never seen this kill anyone, but have had to deal with serious physical ramifications and mental turmoil. The asanas try to keep the physical base progressing in subtlety, in pace with the mind so that disconnections are not so troublesome.

Keep in contact with your Acharya for his advice. As fast as you are moving, can only celebrate your ascent. You are blessed.

What is happening is that the process is causing a radical amplification of life energy flowing onto the physical brain from the subtle second physical body. You will recognize its existence in time. Ultimately for a good cause but nothing you were meant to deal with.

Brain and second body connection regarding subjective physical space distortion is moderated by the brain/mind interface on the cerebral cortex, gray matter.

All your brainwaves are changing and reorganizing, which does not come without some distress adapting to a higher life.

Entry point of body to mind is telepathized onto the mental plate at the juncture of any sensory afferent input. Physical to subtle interface. Anatomical locus is the anterior wedge of the “gyrus precentralis” (hope to fork I spelled it right). The distortions you are feeling are inflicted on a band less than a half inch thick going right to left across your brain in front of the gyrus.

Electrical activity in this region is roughly cemented by a couple years old.

Do anything to alter this and we are screwed up trying to know north or south, left to right until we can adjust.

Analogy might be like one of those 3 way electric light bulbs. Some current and a filament is lit up but the others are latent. Increase the volts and another filament glows and something is illuminated that was hidden before. That's what is happening, but the unfolding to light up a more advanced circuit does not happen without some degree of distress. You are doing fine and on track.

Continue the discipline like your life depends upon it, because it does, as in what are your big plans a couple hundred years from now.


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More help is needed. I have serious doubts that where you have led me to can have any happy ending.

Dreams and nightmares are going crazy and even invading my awake state. I sit and do my “thing” like the teacher prescribed and all I get is my body splattered out over square miles and pressure in my head about to explode.

My mind sees black turning to white and white turning to black like my reality and sense of sanity crumbling into something I cannot grasp. This for me is the definition of chaos and cannot take this for much longer even if you say that this transformation is for some ultimate higher purpose. If what I am experiencing now is the “bliss” of yoga, get me back to the damned spandex parlors. Maybe there was no Nirvana with the weekly payment, but I was left with a frame of reference.

Any and every grain of your advice is requested. I have to ask again what starship you people came from and what is your purpose. How hard is this supposed to be.

I offer all respect to what you must have gone through if you did get success and not just fry your brain in the search,


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Dear Voyager,

Can I interject an opinion into this while waiting for John’s response  You asked how hard is this and if what you are going through is worth it

Pramahansa Yogananda said that if someone is trying to deliver this message, then a hundred people will go by  99 will have no interest or scorn the messenger out of ignorance, but one out of a hundred may stop to listen

Take a hundred who have stopped to listen and only one will take up the practice

Take a hundred who have taken up the practice, and only one will be successful

These are your grim odds and determines your ultimate resolution in a personal fight against death The goal of real yoga is to bounce off of the death experience while you are still alive because that is what we have come here for  If you rely on tribal religions to get the virgins when you are dead, then you will sadly find yourself a day late and a dollar short

Yes you are being blown apart, disassembled and reassembled  Odds are severe against you but you have been given a valid path to prevail The gods envy your chance to fight

One of my favorite stories is about ancient saint Bodhidarma which I hope will put some of this in perspective for you

Precocious kid had a spiritual thirst that could not be answered in his land

An old priest pulled him aside and told him off the record, there was good news and bad news

There was a spiritual Master that could answer all his questions  That was the good news  Bad news was that the location of the Master was in an isolated ice cave at the top of a mountain that few survived to climb  Worse that the hidden cave was a thousand miles away over several impassible mountain ranges and valleys to even get to the foot of the mountain

Bodhidarma was determined and took off to find the Master

The story tells of the struggle of the voyage. Frostbitten on mountain tops Lost in steaming jungles Attacked by tigers, snakes, diseases, insects  He barely made it to the foot of the mountain No guide would take him up because it was an impossible ascent

Bodhidarma started the climb on his own  Scripture tells of the climb

Close to death from starvation and the cold, he found the cave and the Master inside

He prostrated himself at the feet of the Master and requested teaching

The Master refused telling him that he was not strong enough to glimpse Immortality  Thanks for his interest but it was a waste of time to engage in something he didn’t have the strength to achieve  Bodhidarma countered with all the trials and sacrifice he had endured to get there 

The Master was unmoved and told him to go home

Bodhidarma was broken but tried to get home  Story tells of all the reverse traumas and perils  He arrived back in his village a paper thin veil from death

He recovered after a time and realized that this was a test  He went back with all the same assaults and damage again but miraculously made it back to the remote mountain cave

He entered the cave and for a second time begged for the Master’s teaching  The Master replied that he did not want the gift enough to succeed and to go home again

Bodhidarma told the Master that he was not leaving  He would sit outside in the ice and fast until his instruction was granted or he died

Bodhidarma parked himself outside the cave and began his fast

About on the fifth day, Bodhidarma was getting near death  Frostbite, dehydration, the cold was about to take him out and he realized that the Master was just going to let him die

In a last act of desperation, Bodhidarma dug down through the snow and unearthed a large rock  He broke the rock into a piece with a jagged edge and sawed off his right arm

He took his bloody severed arm into the cave and shook it in the face of the spiritual Master. He said “I have still not found Peace”

The Master thought a few minutes and told Bodhidarma that if he really wanted Truth that bad, then there was a slim chance he could be successful

Bodhidarma received the science of introspection and was ultimately successful

After his Enlightment, Bodhidarma set out on his mission to take the Gospel from east to the west, or maybe it was from the west to the east  Can’t remember

The old woodcuts show Bodhidarma on his mule traveling from here to there to spread knowledge, but you will notice they only show him with one arm

I am not advising you to saw off your arm, but take this in context that what you are seeking is at minimum a figurative impossible climb to the snow cave

John mentioned the concept of a “norm” around which we embrace our sense of what is safe and accepted  Problem is that what is normal is not always what is in our best long term interest

You have been given a key to the highest most incredible journeys that a human being can enter into

The price of entry is the death of all your norms, all your concepts, all your safety net of those around you in the same clueless condition, lemmings diving off a cliff  This will not come easy and for awhile will be dogged with pain and struggle until you can get clear Do not give up in the face of rebirth

They say Jesus had to be crucified We are no different if we want to get free

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Sorry for a late reply and for the side effects you are experiencing. I’m off to a volunteer shift at our homeless shelter so will have to wait till later for a better answer.

For right now, two things.

First, limit the time spent to 5-10 minutes twice a day. Understand that abruptly just quitting can lead to side effects as well. Maintain two times a day schedule at all costs.

Second, contact your Acharya and get a phone consult with him. His advice will override anything I have to say.

Be assured that there is nothing that will be thrown at you that you will not also be given the strength to overcome. Hang in there and I will get back to you after my shift.


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My shift at the shelter got moved to later, so a couple more things.

Emphasize that your instruction and state of wellbeing is best known to your Acharya. No doctor, no priest, no spandex parlor instructor can help much less understands what you are experiencing.

The Acharya has an option to temporarily “demote” you to a less intense process (rarely if ever), keep the same process at a temporary reduction in daily total time (possible), although he will likely insist that you do keep two attempts daily without fail.

He may prescribe certain specific “asanas” or “muras” to help mitigate the side effects. These are yoga postures that control hormonal flow and balance.

Don’t be surprised if he tells you that diet is partly to blame and may prescribe an individual program to get you through the rough times.

Ask him about contacts in the Chicago area that you can get with to discuss the adventure and have local support.

About what planet I’m from, purpose and if I fried my brain.

Planet earth like you. Purpose is to end ignorance, and yes, my brain was fried and is still getting fried daily going on 45 years with this. Understand I was in the same place you are now except that it took several months to feel distorted space orientation, and remember strange uncomfortable pressures. Also like you, I questioned if what I was going through was what the yogis were experiencing and calling blissful trance states. Then the vivid dreams and nightmares, mind getting scrambled and having to learn the experience of life from ground zero. The multi level attack of pain was not worth it. I about dumped the commitment and keep my pot and LSD. This would have been a tragic mistake.

It was only with support from local veterans that I continued. One told me that I was opening  a Christmas present of incredible worth, but was in the painful process of having to open the box first.

Jyoti eloquently gave analogies about the difficulties you will face. Nothing will allow you to entirely escape some degree of growing pains. It doesn’t have to be complete torture however, and your instructor can modify your practice as needed to get you to a more stable experience. Guaranteed he won’t ask for your right arm like in the story Jyoti told.

Please keep in touch as you go through this. You are destined for success.


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