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Importing Radar 24 BWFs into CbB;

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Importing RADAR 24 BWFs into Cakewalk by BandLab;

I've been trying to import a BWF project into Cakewalk by BandLab from the internal SSD of my computer.

( I backed up the project from a RADAR 24 (now defunct) into an 0.02 USB  external HD -and later downloaded it into my Desktop's internal SSD)


From looking through the massive CbB Reference Guide I eventually managed to cipher enough to get my previously recorded BWF audio imported into the CbB DAW,  (up to a point).

But the audio project appears in the CbB Import Audio window as thousands of what I assume are referred to as "Clips".  Any of them I can Open and it will then appear on Track 1. on the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] window.
I found that by pressing on the keyboard's Ctrl key ( or the Ctrl & A keys) I could click on numerous of them -one by one, but there's still way too many clips to handle this way, -things just won't work by this method (no matter how much patience I would have), I would get duplicate Clip #s with Copy, Copy 2, and/or Copy Copy, and/or Copy.wav after their numbers. This became an untenable mess and I would then have to meticulously delete all of these duplicates.
I've clicked around the options on the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] window but nothing seems to respond.
-I need to find a simple way to get all of these thousands of BWF Clips put into the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] window so that I can once again listen to and take a look at the 16 track to 24 track BWF audio project.

I hope someone can help me. (-I don't think it'll be a difficult thing to resolve.-)

-What I get is an orderly vertical list of thousands of tiny wave files, (clips?) -that for some reason start off at the top or beginning of the list with two unusual numbers 000000b6.wav, and 000000e4.wav.
-Then the long vertical list of tiny wave file numbers proceed on to ;
0001b7a0.wav
0001b7a1.wav
0001b7a2.wav
0001b7a3.wav
0001b7a4.wav
0001b7a5.wav
0001b7a6.wav
0001b7a7.wav
0001b7a8.wav
0001b7a9.wav
0001b7aa.wav
0001b7ab.wav
0001b7ac.wav
0001b7ad.wav
0001b7ae.wav
0001b7af.wav
0001b7b0.wav
0001b7b1.wav
0001b7b2.wav
0001b7b3.wav
0001b7b4.wav
0001b7b5.wav
0001b7b6.wav
0001b7b7.wav
0001b7b8.wav
0001b7b9.wav
0001b7ba.wav
0001b7bb.wav
0001b7bc.wav
0001b7bd.wav
0001b7be.wav
0001b7bf.wav
0001b7c0.wav
0001b7c1.wav
0001b7c2.wav
0001b7c3.wav
0001b7c4.wav
0001b7c5.wav
0001b7c6.wav
0001b7c7.wav
0001b7c8.wav
0001b7c9.wav
0001b7ca.wav
0001b7cb.wav
0001b7cc.wav
0001b7cd.wav
0001b7ce.wav
0001b7cf.wav
0001b7d0.wav
0001b7d1.wav
0001b7d2.wav
0001b7d3.wav
0001b7d4.wav
0001b7d5.wav
0001b7d6.wav
0001b7d7.wav
0001b7d8.wav
0001b7d9.wav
0001b7da.wav
0001b7db.wav
0001b7dc.wav -etc., etc., ....... -all the way to, 00827995.wav

I would be able to play & hear a little bit of the song lyric depending on what clip I chose, highlighted & Opened -on these first tiny wave file clips on top of this list containing the vocal track each clip would contain perhaps one line of the song.

I found this in the CbB Reference Guide;

To select the clips that are linked to another clip
1. Select one or more clips in the Track view.
2. Right-click on any selected clip and choose Select All Siblings from the pop-up menu.
Cakewalk selects any clip that is linked to one of the currently selected clips
-But this didn't work, as I found no Select All Siblings in the pop-up menu )


-As well, also in the CbB Ref. Guide "To import a Broadcast Wave file:"

1. If you want Cakewalk to import Broadcast Wave files always at their timestamped location, go to Edit > Preferences > File - Audio Data and select the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box.
Otherwise, set the Now Time and current track to indicate where the audio should be placed.
2. Choose File > Import > Audio to display the Open dialog box.


-I tried Edit > Preferences > File - Audio Data and selected the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box, -then the File > Import > Audio to display the Open dialog box, -but it didn't make any difference.

I did find the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box, -but no mention of "Now Time", -there was instead a BWF Default setting however, -I wonder if that is the same as "Now Time"?

What I have in the way of a BWF project that I'm trying to import is a large sprawling thing with many parts of multiple variations of a song that I'm in the process of comping & editing. -So I am left with the question of whether to chose Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box, -or "Now Time", -I need everything lined up the same as it was in the original project.

Basically right now what I need to know most is just how to highlight all of the thousands of clips so I can click on Open -and get the audio into the CbB project.

I must explain that this BWF project is not from an older version of Sonar.

This is not a project with stacked dupes of the same clips that are not time stamped. -This project comes from a Radar 24 -and is a lot of copy & paste stuff.

It's a prototype project with 3 different versions of the same song, -all with various different intros, musical interludes, bridges, & codas copied & pasted one after the other so that I can choose which ones I like best. -They're all in a row so I would just play the audio & listen for the stuff I liked best. This was found to be the easiest way for me to do the prototype comping work in the Radar 24.

These are not "Revisions" of each other. -However I have begun reading about Revisions in the CbB Reference Guide and though it all still seems quite involved & confusing right now, -I do think that it may very well be a helpful way to approach such prototype development work in the future -should I continue with CbB.

-I'm not sure what is  meant when they say, "left justify" or "left justifying the parent project" -does this involve left-clicking on -so as to highlight something?  (I'm new to computer DAW operations) -will "left justify" come into this importing matter ?

These clips are not duplicate clips, the ones on the very top of the list are the vocal track, (track#1.) -and as you go down the list you get whatever's on the tracks #2 ,3,4, -to track #2 4 -all in these tiny "clips", one after the other.
The reason that there's so many thousands of them is because I had the entire Radar 24 project screen filled with various comping experiments and many, (about 16) different intros, musical interludes, bridges, & codas copied & pasted one after each other, of which I chose out of them all, perhaps 3 or 4 favorites for each. I haven't got to the stage yet where I actually chosen the one that I'm going to go with.

As I said if I highlight any one of these clips & click on Open the selected clip will appear on track 1 of my project. If I press Ctrl or Ctrl & A and highlight 2, 3 or 4 of these clips & click on Open the selected clips will also appear on track 1 of my project. -It's just not very do-able to get all 8 thousand or so clips highlighted or selected in this way. I'm confident that If I could do so, I would be able to click on Open -and the entire project (with all 8 thousand clips) would appear in my CbB project.

NOTE:  I also found in the CbB Reference Guide;

To select the clips that are linked to another clip 

1. Select one or more clips in the Track view. 

2. Right-click on any selected clip and choose Select All Siblings from the pop-up menu. 

Cakewalk selects any clip that is linked to one of the currently selected clips  

 -Unfortunately this didn't work, -as there was no Select All Siblings in pop-up menu  ( ? -perhaps some preliminary setting was wrong ? )


In the CbB Ref. Guide "To import a Broadcast Wave file:" where it says,

"1. If you want Cakewalk to import Broadcast Wave files always at their timestamped location, go to Edit > Preferences > File - Audio Data and select the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box.
Otherwise, set the Now Time and current track to indicate where the audio should be placed.
2. Choose File > Import > Audio to display the Open dialog box."

-I did find the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box, -but no mention of "Now Time", -there was instead a BWF Default setting, (-I was wondering if that is the same as "Now Time") -Now I'm thinking, seeing as this project comes out of a Radar 24 and probably has neither "Timestamp" or "Now Time" perhaps the BWF Default setting is the one that I need ?

Someone has said that they never have any trouble saving and loading bundle files from and to Cakewalk, -this may be key.

When looking in the CbB Ref. Guide, Bundle files seemed like it could be something else -however perhaps I should look more into "bundle files"?

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23 hours ago, azslow3 said:

May be complete miss... but I remembered REAPER has RADAR projects import. May be worse a try.

Thanks azslow3 for your reply;

It's nice to know that REAPER has RADAR projects import.....

-You never know, if worse comes to worse I may need to look into the REAPER DAW.

 

I'm still holding out, figuring that surly this BWF project will be easily imported into CbB, once I find the way to select & highlight all of the thousands of clips.

 

I don't believe that this 24 bit BWF project coming from a RADAR 24 would have a bearing on the matter....

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When the CbB documentation refers to  clip linking it means having the SAME clip referenced multiple places in a project NOT sequentially linking different files during import. This allows one to edit one clip and affect all the other linked copies of the clip.

Bundles are a proprietary format for storing the project and audio data into a single file. This had nothing to do with importing data from other DAWs.

Revisions are files created by the CbB version control system. Again this has nothing to do with importing data from other DAWs.

 

It seems you have a collection of Broadcast Wave Files exported from Radar 24.

When it comes to importing BWF the only relevant portion of the CbB documentation is timestamp setting in preferences.

During import CbB can position the files on the timeline based on their embedded timestamps.

Other than their position on the timeline, CbB has no idea how the files are organized.

 

If you know the track the files belong to, they may be imported one track at a time by

  1. Create a track
  2. Open the take lanes
  3. File > Import > Audio
  4. Select the clips to import in the track and click OK

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I must thank Cakewalk user forum members  Kurre and scook for their useful comments.

Although I'm not there yet, I do know that I'm a lot closer.

The thing is, today nothing works the same as it did previously with my CbB....

Now when in "BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] and (as I've done before) click File > Import > Audio -and get an "Import Audio" window, and then click on the audio library scroll and select & click on the Desktop's Internal SSD (containing my RADAR 24 BWF audio files) -and then click & highlight on the specific audio file folder wanted so it appears on the "File name" box, & click on "Open" -so that the title in the "Lock in:" changes to the original R24 project name, (as was mentioned in the CbB Reference Guide) -putting the original project title in the "File name" box & then clicking "Open" & entering "Audio Files" (from the list that comes up) into the "File name" box.-and again click on "Open", -I get that same orderly vertical list of thousands of clips that for some reason starts off at the top or beginning of the list with two unusual numbers 000000b6.wav, and 000000e4.wav., and then proceeds on to 0001b7a0.wav, 0001b7a1.wav, 0001b7a2.wav,  0001b7a3.wav, -etc., etc., .... -all the way to, 00827995.wav.  -The thing is I used to be able to click on any of them and click Open and the clip would then appear on Track 1. on the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] window.

For whatever reason I now cannot seem to select any of these clips and import them into Track 1 of my CbB project.

Cakewalk user forum member Kurre's information re holding on Ctrl & Shift enabled me to select & highlight any number of these thousands of Clips.

By this method, -selecting/clicking on the first clips (000000b6.wav, 000000e4.wav., 0001b7a0.wav, 0001b7a1.wav, 0001b7a2.wav, and 0001b7a3.wav) and then clicking the very last clip, (00827995.wav.) I was even able to highlight all of these thousands of clips, -although nothing appeared in the "File name" box -and when I clicked "Open" it wouldn't process.

What's worse is that I'm having trouble now as well with playing & listening to any of these Clips. -If what Cakewalk user forum member scook says holds true re, "If you know the track the files belong to, they may be imported one track at a time" -that explains why I couldn't import all of them at once, -even with selecting the Always Import Broadcast Waves at Their Timestamp check box, that I do now when I  go to Edit > Preferences > File - Audio Data because of the relevance of the timestamp setting that scook indicated re importing BWF into the CbB DAW.

It does appear that CbB can only import one track at a time.  

-I would be able to figure out what files (or clips) belong to which tracks if I can listen to them.

I know that track #1. is the vocal track, track #2. is the guitar track, #3 & #4 tracks are parallel compression Bass tracks etc., etc.

So if I can only import one track at a time, I'm going to need to be able to again play & listen to these Clips.

-I have to wonder what is different now that's changing it's operations.....

-I noticed the [+} AddTrack setting involved in the processes on scook's excellent animated demonstration of the CbB project screen -so when trying to import all of the 24 tracks of the RADAR 24 BWF (with redo) project file -I tried a few experiments....

In "BASIC.cwt" by clicking on [+] "Duplicate track" (while the 1st track & 2nd track was empty) I was able to add 22 more tracks -giving me the full 24 track layout that my BWF project has (that I'm trying to Import), -that didn't work. -Then I tried again, clicking on [+} "AddTrack" on the left of "Duplicate Track" and also seemed able to add on  22 more tracks although this time they were all thinner than track #1 & #2.  -When that didn't work I tried the "16-Track.cwt" box off of the "Cakewalk Start Screen" but nothing seemed to work for me there either.

It really does seem that CbB users can only import one track at a time.

Note: I saw from viewing scook's excellent animated demonstration of the CbB project screen, that there's differences to that of my CbB DAW screen layout. -They seem to be only minute differences, (my CbB DAW was installed last summer, -perhaps scook's is a newer updated CbB ?) I wonder if that has a bearing on anything ?

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The most recent version of CbB is 2021.09 but the importing into a year old version of CbB is no different.

The same version of CbB may look different depending on how the user sets up the DAW.

I mostly run with workspaces set to None and the default layout and a user theme I created on a single monitor.

 

If you need to preview the clips before importing it may be faster to use the media browser instead of the import dialog.

  • Navigate to the clip folder in the media browser.
  • Click on a clip to preview.
  • Drag clip(s) into an existing track or create a track by dropping a clip to the blank space in the clip pane.

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^^^^ I got the feeling that Ctrl & Shift was aimed for use with the browser and dragging the files to the track.

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What I need to know now, is a way to clear the decks, -and get the blue star off of "BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk Start Screen, -as things are, I'm just getting more & more confused.

Similar to what I began indicating in my Tuesday 11:10 AM post, the thing is, today things arne't working the same as previously with my CbB, -only this time things aren't working the same with additional different regards as well....

Now when double clicking on the CbB ICON on the Desktop screen, "BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk Start Screen has a blue star in the top left corner.

-And now after clicking on BASIC.cwt (with the blue star in the top left corner) -when the Cakewalk [Untitled Project*] window comes up, (as it's always done before), when I click File > Import > Audio and get an "Import Audio" window,  -but it's not the same, now it comes up as a full screen-Import Audio window, not the smaller dialogue window box that use to allow me to then click on the audio library scroll and then select & click on the Desktop's Internal SSD (containing my RADAR 24 BWF audio files -and then click & highlight on the specific audio file folder wanted so it appears on the "File name" box, & click on "Open" -so that the title in the "Lock in:" changes to the original R24 project name, (as was mentioned in the CbB Reference Guide) -putting the original project title in the "File name" box & then clicking "Open" & entering "Audio Files" (from the list that comes up) into the "File name" box.-and again click on "Open", -when I would then get that same orderly vertical list of thousands of clips.  -Then I was able to select any of these clips & Open them & the clip would appear on Track #1. of the new untitled project.

Now, when I scroll down the list of the Lock in window box of this full screen-Import Audio window and select Audio Library and then type in Audio Library into the File name window box & click on Open I get a very small "Import Audio" window box (in the middle of the full screen-Import Audio window) with a yellow triangle with a exclamation mark! in the middle of it -stating "audio library  File not found  Check the file name and try again  [OK]"

I pressed "[OK]" and then tried selecting "New Volume (D)" (the Desktop's Internal SSD containing my RADAR 24 BWF audio files) -then typing in Audio Library into the File name window box & clicking on Open I again got the small "Import Audio" window box with the yellow triangle!  -this time stating "New Volumn (D)  File not found  Check the file name and try again  [OK]"

I pressed "[OK]" again and then tried selecting "#2nov2020withredo" (the Folder from Desktop's Internal SSD containing the specific  RADAR 24 BWF audio files that I want to import &work on) -then typed in #2nov2020withredo into the File name window box & clicked on Open but I again got the small "Import Audio" window box with the yellow triangle!  -this time stating "#2nov2020withredo  File not found  Check the file name and try again  [OK]"

After pressing "[OK]" -I then selected "MAY Triplets L V_01-24_RADAR" (the original RADAR 24 project name, (as was mentioned that would come up at this point in the process in the CbB Reference Guide -also containing the same specific  RADAR 24 BWF audio files that I want to import &work on) -then typed in MAY Triplets L V_01-24_RADAR into the File name window box & clicked on Open, -this time however I got a familiar list under the Lock in window box (now with MAY Triplets L V_01-24_RADAR)  -

Name                                                                           Date modified                                                     Type                                                    Size 

[ ]  Audio Files                                                          2021 - 10 - 19  10:13 AM                              File folder                                                                                                                                                    [ }  Disk Info Files                                                    2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                File folder                                                                                                                                                    [ }  Project Info Files                                              2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                 File folder                                                                                                                                                  [ }  RADAR System Files                                     2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                 File folder          

Then selecting Audio Files and clicking on Open I finally got the by now quite familiar long list of thousands of "Clips"

I  clicked on & highlighted one of the many "Clips" and then clicked on Open. -But I got a small Cakewalk windowbox,  "Intel(R) Display Audio" (with a spherical blue symbol containing a question mark) stating, "The above Audio/Midi device was disconnected from your system. Would you like Cakewalk to reroute these outputs to an available devise?" -"Click "No" to keep current settings"     [ Yes }         [ No ]

I had this happen before much earlier in this endeavor so I again clicked on [ Yes ]

The  "Intel(R) Display Audio" Cakewalk windowbox went away and the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] full screen window appeared, however with no audio or visual sign of the clip present on Track #1. of the project.-as was the case before Tuesday -and the BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk Start Screen having a blue star in the top left corner was noticed.   ( I could now barely see very faint little white dots  on track #1. ? - sometime after after other things were done the little faint white dots were noticed as having disappeared.... )

Now when on the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] full screen window when I click File > Import > Audio I go directly to that new unfamiliar full screen  "Import Audio" window, -with the thousands of clips,

I found the "Media" box on the top right of the Cakewalk - [Untitled Project*] full screen window -when I place the mouse's directional arrow over the "Media" box  a "Browse media files on your computer  Media browser" message appears. -So far I haven't had much luck with it. I was able to import some clips (but not with audio clip appearing on Track #1.  as was the case before the blue star was noticed on  "BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk Start Screen.

The visual indications were much different, and all of these "Browser" clip visual indications were stacked up upon each other on different tracks. I couldn't get any sound playing into my headphones.

This may be mostly because I don't know my way around the DAW yet.

I may have inadvertently made copied files of some sort every time I went through the File > Import > Audio etc. process as outlined earlier in the thread      -that has changed things....

If I can work on this with the DAW operating in the same manner as I had it, -with these clips appearing on the project's Track #1 when I opened them I think that I will be able to get it together, -as things are, I'm just getting more & more confused.

 

I think that what I need to know now, is a way to clear the decks, -and get that blue star off of "BASIC.cwt" on the Cakewalk Start Screen.

 

That should be an easy & simple function, it's embarrassing that I can't seem to find it.

 

 

 

 

 

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Because of having beginner's difficulty playing & listening to any of the clips on CbB, I've been  trying things with Reaper -as  azslow3 suggest on Oct. 16.

I'm open to the idea of importing the RADAR 24 files -one track at a time, but I really need to know where these tracks begin & end to do that.

I found the import process to be very much the same with Reaper as it is with CbB.

I did everything the same with Reaper as I had done with Cakewalk (see my Oct. 21 post) -but instead of getting that long list of thousands of clips when I entered "Audio files" and clicked on Open with Reaper as I did with CbB, -Reaper would only give me a "No items match your search" message.

I tried  a few variations to my approach & finally tried selecting "RADAR System files" (instead of "Audio Files") into the File name box & clicking on [Open] 

RE:

Name                                                                           Date modified                                                     Type                                                    Size 

[ ]  Audio Files                                                          2021 - 10 - 19  10:13 AM                              File folder                                                                                                                                                    [ }  Disk Info Files                                                    2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                File folder                                                                                                                                                    [ }  Project Info Files                                              2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                 File folder                                                                                                                                                  [ }  RADAR System Files                                     2021 - 08 - 30   4:15 AM                                 File folder      

-This made a difference !

I managed to get the first 5 tracks of the RADAR project imported into the Reaper DAW.

-Although it is by no means clear as of yet as to why it couldn't import the entire project, that is progress....

I'm now wondering if entering "RADAR System files" instead of "Audio Files" into the File name box & clicking on [Open] would work or make the difference with CbB ?  

 

If need be is it possible to import audio files ("one track at a time") from Reaper into CbB ?

 

Are there any thoughts regarding any of this ?

 

 

 

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REAPER claims it support some RADAR Project files. So the file where whole project is defined. That should load related tracks and position audio files correctly.

Revise "Project Info Files" and "RADAR System Files". There can be more then one file with expected extension and/or several project files (I never had RADAR), but I guess REAPER  parse one file (not directory) which you select in the Open dialog. You have to find right one.

Cakewalk has no special support for RADAR Projects. Once you get the project in REAPER, you will have to use usual procedure to transfer files between DAWs, so render each track into separate WAVs and then import them into CbB.

 

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