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kitekrazy

The delusional world of Linux.

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11 hours ago, Grem said:

But you got to give it to Linux for taking the server market. They got that by the a$$. Even with MS might trying to force it's way into the lead, it has fallen short. I don't think they have given up, but certainly even they see the writing on the wall, no? : )

Shhh! Don't tell anyone, but ...

The most popular operating system on Microsoft's Azure cloud today is -- drumroll please -- Linux.

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Um, so what are Linux and Windows both based on again? 🙄

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Microsoft seems to have taken a different direction lately, embracing Linux and open source: .NET core is open source, they've recently open sourced their calculator app, news suggests they're replacing the Edge browser's engine with Chromium (and contributing to Chromium as well).

The problem with Windows server/IIS compared to Linux for servers is probably license costs and size of server images. The advantage of Linux is that it's free (and so server/hosting costs are less), which probably relates to why desktop adoption isn't so great: it's not built in the same way to the same timescale that a commercial company with multiple teams, each with their own discipline, would work together full time on a product.

I'm not being dismissive of open source projects: I think e.g. Linux, GIMP, Blender, Inkscape are all very sophisticated and feature-rich pieces of software; I'm just saying they also have their learning curves.

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6 minutes ago, craigb said:

Um, so what are Linux and Windows both based on again? 🙄

I'm not sure I understand the question; do you mean the PC architecture? or desktop operating systems?

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1 minute ago, antler said:

I'm not sure I understand the question; do you mean the PC architecture? or desktop operating systems?

I'm guessing it must be PC architecture, because apart from that they're very different.

And now of course, Linux will run on almost anything.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, craigb said:

They all evolved from Unix.

Linux and Mac evolved from UNIX.

Windows 3.x through the 9x versions evolved from an IBM mainframe operating system called DOS, later developed by IBM and Microsoft into MS-DOS and PC-DOS for x86 systems.

Microsoft had used a UNIX based system called Xenix, but that was licensed from AT&T, and later acquired by SCO UNIX. It was never actually part of the DOS evolution for MS though.

Windows NT, 2000. XP, and so on were developed from the NT rewrites of the OS/2 operating system that Microsoft had co-developed with IBM. So Windows today is an "NT" based OS.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS-DOS

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenix

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT_3.1

UNIX History Diagram

 

Edited by abacab

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Posted (edited)

Isn’t Android a Linux “distro”? That must be more than Windows. But I don’t like using google product. Don’t like it. Same with Apple.

I was a Microsoft fan for years, but not anymore. They had something good going years ago but destroyed the trust to the fans to many times.

I am trying to go over to Linux, but I am a bit trapped in this Microsoft world. Not only DAWs an such. I could live with dual boot to make that happen on my main PC. But my other PCs does not support Linux. Well not those distros I want anyways. I am stuck for now.

 

Edited by ØSkald

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Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, ØSkald said:

Isn’t Android a Linux “distro”? That must be more than Windows. But I don’t like using google product. Don’t like it. Same with Apple.

I was a Microsoft fan for years, but not anymore. They had something good going years ago but destroyed the trust to the fans to many times.

I am trying to go over to Linux, but I am a bit trapped in this Microsoft world. Not only DAWs an such. I could live with dual boot to make that happen on my main PC. But my other PCs does not support Linux. Well not those distros I want anyways. I am stuck for now.

 

Android is not actually a Linux "distro". It is a Google customized version of the Linux "kernel", plus additional Google software that allowed them to create the Android OS, which is capable of running Android Apps. But creating a Linux distro implies that all of the necessary open source GNU/Linux  software  (and  often a desktop environment and other Linux applications) are distributed along with the Linux kernel, which together makes up a complete Linux operating system.

I agree with feeling "trapped"  by Windows as far as audio goes. I don't particularly care for Microsoft anymore, but Windows just works (mostly).

Desktop Linux is good for programming and web development, or for ordinary tasks like web surfing, email, media players, and general office productivity.

But for music production, you might be able to make Linux work if you are hard headed and have the patience and time to do the research, testing, and configuration for a setup to work for your needs. If you despise MS badly enough, you might be able to work up the motivation for the task. But your options will still be fairly limited compared with Windows as far as available hardware and software  support. 

A while back I spent a couple of weekends exploring Linux audio on a dedicated Linux desktop, mostly out of curiosity about whether it could be done. Then I stopped short and slapped myself in the face, and went back to Windows, LOL!

Because Windows always just works for me (mostly)!  :D

 

Edited by abacab

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5 hours ago, abacab said:

Linux and Mac evolved from UNIX.

Windows 3.x through the 9x versions evolved from an IBM mainframe operating system called DOS, later developed by IBM and Microsoft into MS-DOS and PC-DOS for x86 systems.

Microsoft had used a UNIX based system called Xenix, but that was licensed from AT&T, and later acquired by SCO UNIX. It was never actually part of the DOS evolution for MS though.

Windows NT, 2000. XP, and so on were developed from the NT rewrites of the OS/2 operating system that Microsoft had co-developed with IBM. So Windows today is an "NT" based OS.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS-DOS

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenix

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT_3.1

UNIX History Diagram

 

Keep going.  (And you probably shouldn't use wikipedia as a reference source!  LOL!)

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, craigb said:

Keep going.  (And you probably shouldn't use wikipedia as a reference source!  LOL!)

LOL! I started working with mainframes in the mid 70's, so I know a thing or two about OS evolution.  35+ years in the IT field. Your move. ;)

And I  put that wiki sh*t up there for general reference purposes, so I wouldn't come across as just making that stuff up.

As soon as you said Windows evolved from UNIX, I realized that you were delusional!

 

Edited by abacab
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Kids these days... 😜

I meant go further back!  (BTW - I started on mainframes before UNIX was "official" in 1970.)

Gary (Kildall) borrowed heavily on UNIX's shells, pipes and command formats when he made Computer Program/Monitor (which became CP/M, then DOS, etc.).  Most of the exact same syntax is still there today when you bring up the command prompt.  At least we never had to use VI on Windows!  (Though you could get a version of it if you really wanted to.)

Side note:  I helped port Advent to the HP-2000 in '76 and I should still have the source printed out in storage! A hollow voice says "Plugh!" 😀

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, craigb said:

Kids these days... 😜

I meant go further back!  (BTW - I started on mainframes before UNIX was "official" in 1970.)

Gary (Kildall) borrowed heavily on UNIX's shells, pipes and command formats when he made Computer Program/Monitor (which became CP/M, then DOS, etc.).  Most of the exact same syntax is still there today when you bring up the command prompt.  At least we never had to use VI on Windows!  (Though you could get a version of it if you really wanted to.)

Side note:  I helped port Advent to the HP-2000 in '76 and I should still have the source printed out in storage! A hollow voice says "Plugh!" 😀

That's kind of a stretch going from UNIX, to CP/M, then DOS. More a case of borrowed and shared ideas, than a direct documented lineage. But as with many tech advances  like the mouse, or the graphic UI, it is sometimes difficult to credit the original inventor (Xerox?).

I do remember CP/M. We had one machine with that running network diagnostics.

We also played some cool text based games on it when we were working late nights. :D

 

Edited by abacab

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Yep!  Xerox is where the mouse came from and I was the only person I knew who had their companion invention which was not adopted:

bat_keyboard_a831d.jpg

The idea was to have one hand on the mouse and one hand on the keyboard.  You played chords to make all the different keys and numbers.  Once you get used to it, everyone ends up typing about 40 wpm regardless of whether you were a 10 wpm or 80 wpm typer to begin with.

batalphart.jpg

Here's part of the cheat sheet.

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7 minutes ago, Gswitz said:

How old are you guys??

Uh-oh, cover blown! xD

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9 minutes ago, Gswitz said:

How old are you guys??

I started young.  Did you ever hear about those teenage hackers recruited by Defense Contractors?  That was me.  $34/hour back during the Cold War days!  I wish I knew just how awesome that was back then like I do now...

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Noice!

image.png.6277dd5168a698ade9af685a6fe262f1.png

This is what I had a terminal logged into when UNIX v1 came out.  It was so long ago that we had to use lowercase "L's" for 1's!  😆

 

pghp2.gif

We had to use an acoustic coupler where, if you whistled into the phone just right (4,800 Hz I believe), you could connect at 300 BAUD, otherwise you were stuck with 110 BAUD...

d32fd2389d2d0b53b827e469027f444c.jpg

 

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tongues.jpg

This is fun!

After a couple of college classes at SDSU while still in high school, I enrolled for a bunch of classes at a community college, made the football team, but only got two calculus classes and dropped off the team.  I was supposed to go to Annapolis and fly F-14's, but I grew too tall so, next I went to a private, IT-based college where I took four years in two (Coleman College).  I had classes in Assembler, Fortran, PL/I, COBOL, BASIC, RPG and C.  Since I had already been programming in a few of those, I had time to set the high score on the Miss PacMan machine during breaks.

Half-way through, we all had internships with "real" companies so we could learn not to wear white socks with suits and they could use us for copying and data entry.  I got to go to a Defense Contractor (CSC) and, during the initial orientation meeting, the Senior Contracts Administrator was disappointed that we weren't there to code something for her (because we hadn't had classes in that language yet).  However, I already knew it and jumped at the chance to do something new.  Within a couple of days I had figured out who the "REAL" programmers were, secretly hacked into their accounts to learn all their coding techniques and created the basics of the program that maintained all modifications to the project contract for over five years.  At the end of the week-long internship, several guys there lobbied for me to get a contract to finish my work.  Next thing I know, I've got a lucrative consulting job as a teenager which turned into being the tech-lead for the CMQA department where I got to build everything and even work on the guidance system of the Tomahawk Missile System.  I also got favorably noticed by DEC by pointing out some major vulnerabilities in their system ('cause I'd used them!  LOL!).  I was there for five years until the main project was cancelled.  For most of the time we were right across the street from Miramar Naval Airbase where I had a base pass (ironic to think I could have been flying out of there!).  I found out during a Change In Command ceremony that my cousin had been the base commander there!  I met with several Admirals there (Cold War paranoia mostly), but never ran into my cousin.  Small world!

Ah...  Mammaries! 😋

I'll save the story of how Biff became the name of the mail app on Unix for a later time.  LOL!

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