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Max Arwood

7 mini dumps saved from crashes so far this year [solved]

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Posted (edited)

4 - Cakewalk  - 01/01/2020 to 01/05/2020

3 - plugins in cakewalk. 01/01/2020 to 01/05/2020

9 - Cakewalk mini dump crashes 12/2019

Win 7 - I know Win7 is not supported this year.

Any takers?

 

Thanks,

Max Arwood

Edited by Max Arwood
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Put your crash dumps (zip them up) on a file service (dropbox/Google Drive/what ever) and post a link to it.  Someone (maybe me) will generally open your crash dump with a debugger and tell you what crashed.  I can't guarantee it will be useful, but it might give you a direction to look.  Doesn't really matter if Cakewalk is or isn't supporting Windows 7, your crash is almost surely going to be a plugin or device driver, but knowing what is crashing can often help.  You could also send the crash dumps to Cakewalk or you could download a copy of Microsoft Visual Studio and open the crash dump yourself.  Other ways of analyzing the dumps I don't really recommend, apps that claim to look at dumps rarely are that useful -- you pretty much need to read the call stacks by hand to get any decent picture.

To save time ask yourself these questions:  Am I using any 32bit plugins?  Have I updated my audio and video card drivers and everything else I can (yes with Win 7 that's difficult but not impossible).   Can I reproduce the crash using a minimum number of steps?  Can I reproduce the crash repeatable with a specific project in a specific way?  Software doesn't normally crash randomly (the kinds of hardware failures that would cause that will cause all kinds of problems in every app you run and just Windows itself), so you can play detective and work out how/why it crashes.

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Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 28_12142019_194730.dmp
Crashed in Dimension Pro x64.dll

God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen New 11_11242019_210407.dmp
Crashed in FabFilter Pro-Q 3.vst3

What Child Is This 53_12222019_014053.dmp
Crashed in Drumagog5.dll

076 Symphonic O Come, O Come Emmanuel_12092019_213449.dmp
No plugins in the call stack, just Cakewalk.
A lot of Omnisphere threads and two BitBridge threads, so at least two 32bit plugins (not a good idea)

082 Emmanuel with audio and new piano 07_01022020_203417.dmp
082 Emmanuel with audio and new piano 09_01042020_202412.dmp
Auto-save Copy of Silent Night 27_12222019_212014.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 34_12192019_013807.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 37_12192019_211608.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 40_12272019_231328.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 46_12282019_214312.dmp
There are all pretty much the same as 076 Symphonic O Come, O Come Emmanuel_12092019_213449.dmp
Just Cakewalk in the crashing thread (so no clear guide to what caused the crash).  Bitbridged plugins.
There are a lot of plugins in these crashes though, any one of which could be the problem.  I also see a loaded
copy of Intel's math library libiomp5md.dll which comes in dozens of versions, I know of a few plugins that
require one version of it and will crash with another, since it's shared and not version controlled.  But tracking that
down is nearly impossible.  I only vaguely remember the crazy games I went through to sort that out.


Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 45_12282019_194812.dmp
Crashed in Synth 1 VST64.DLL

Hark The Herald Angels Sing 06_01012020_174536.dmp
Crashed in Pigments.vst3

It Came Upon a Midnight Clear - GB 39_01052020_151210.dmp
Crashed in Kontakt 5.dll

Silent Night 27_12222019_202317.dmp
No plugins in the call stack, just Cakewalk
A few bitbridge plugins.  No intel math library threads.  But otherwise a lot like the above crashes.

What Child Is This 53_12222019_004139.dmp
Crashed in TriLeveler2.x64.dll

One thing I think is true of all these crashes is you are using a lot of plugins that use OpenGL.  I'd start with my
video card driver.  Do a full clean uninstall/install of the most recent driver you can find.

Your audio driver seems to be ASIOEchoPCI.dll but the version you are running says it's v8.06.0.0 dated 11/22/2011 but I see
Google hits for a v8.5  That might also be something to look at (though the 8.5 ones seem dated earlier than yours)

I'd also install every single one of the Microsoft Windows Runtime files and then reboot.
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/2977003/the-latest-supported-visual-c-downloads

Plus I'd do a full Windows Update and install every last update you can.

But with this many different plugins crashing and the kinds of projects you are running you are going to have a very hard to narrowing it down.  The best you can do is update every thing, uninstall everything you don't need (system utilities/crazy apps/etc), try and narrow the crashes down to repeatable steps.  Also dump the 32-bit plugins, getting that stable with the number/variety of plugins your projects are using is almost surely a lost cause.

 

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On 1/6/2020 at 10:34 PM, Matthew Sorrels said:

WOW Thanks a bunch. 

Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 28_12142019_194730.dmp
Crashed in Dimension Pro x64.dll

Dimension Pro x64.dll was not loaded in this project

 

God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen New 11_11242019_210407.dmp
Crashed in FabFilter Pro-Q 3.vst3

FabFilter Pro-Q 3.vst3 was loaded

 

What Child Is This 53_12222019_014053.dmp
Crashed in Drumagog5.dll

Drumagog5.dll was not loaded in this project

 

076 Symphonic O Come, O Come Emmanuel_12092019_213449.dmp
No plugins in the call stack, just Cakewalk.
A lot of Omnisphere threads and two BitBridge threads, so at least two 32bit plugins (not a good idea)

I could only find one 32 bit VST - Reverb.it - I use this reverb for snare - I have dozens of reverbs and have not found a replacement for this.  I guess I need to look harder. Reverb.it has a great low cut built in and a perfect sound for snare.  I have others but none of these make "THAT" sound  - Pro-R,Lexicon Plate,Lex Vintage Plate, Lex Hall, Lex Chambers, Vahalla verbs, Abbey Chamber verbs, Renverb, Truverb, H-Verb,Little Plate Waves-IR's.PSP2445, Blackhole,LexPSP42, Lexicon Pantheon, some CLA and other stuff with reverbs in them, but nothing like reverb.it  I even have the newer version of reverbit called SilverSpike R2 - still no go.

What do you use for your snares to have a long bright reverb tail?

Not sure what the other 32 bit VSTs were. - looking - can only find one.

 

082 Emmanuel with audio and new piano 07_01022020_203417.dmp
082 Emmanuel with audio and new piano 09_01042020_202412.dmp
Auto-save Copy of Silent Night 27_12222019_212014.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 34_12192019_013807.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 37_12192019_211608.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 40_12272019_231328.dmp
Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 46_12282019_214312.dmp
There are all pretty much the same as 076 Symphonic O Come, O Come Emmanuel_12092019_213449.dmp
Just Cakewalk in the crashing thread (so no clear guide to what caused the crash).  Bitbridged plugins.
There are a lot of plugins in these crashes though, any one of which could be the problem.  I also see a loaded
copy of Intel's math library libiomp5md.dll which comes in dozens of versions, I know of a few plugins that
require one version of it and will crash with another, since it's shared and not version controlled.  But tracking that
down is nearly impossible.  I only vaguely remember the crazy games I went through to sort that out.

*libiomp5md.dll variations would be hard to track down 


Away in the Manger - Cradle Song 45_12282019_194812.dmp
Crashed in Synth 1 VST64.DLL

Its funny - I think this synth was frozen???? Don't know how that could cause a crash.

Well it free - and a really nice Synth.  I guess I should limit my use of it.

 

Hark The Herald Angels Sing 06_01012020_174536.dmp
Crashed in Pigments.vst3

Test Driving @$49  offer.  I guess it would be a deal at this price since it is $99 on sale.

 

 

On 1/6/2020 at 10:34 PM, Matthew Sorrels said:

It Came Upon a Midnight Clear - GB 39_01052020_151210.dmp
Crashed in Kontakt 5.dll

I have Kontakt 6 - Converting most songs to it now.

 

Silent Night 27_12222019_202317.dmp
No plugins in the call stack, just Cakewalk
A few bitbridge plugins.  No intel math library threads.  But otherwise a lot like the above crashes.

What Child Is This 53_12222019_004139.dmp
Crashed in TriLeveler2.x64.dll

This plugin is not loaded??

 

One thing I think is true of all these crashes is you are using a lot of plugins that use OpenGL.  I'd start with my
video card driver.  Do a full clean uninstall/install of the most recent driver you can find.

This is a great idea.

 

Your audio driver seems to be ASIOEchoPCI.dll but the version you are running says it's v8.06.0.0 dated 11/22/2011 but I see
Google hits for a v8.5  That might also be something to look at (though the 8.5 ones seem dated earlier than yours)

8.06 is the last of my series Sound Card - I think Windows XP version.  I'm surprised it still works.

 

I'd also install every single one of the Microsoft Windows Runtime files and then reboot.
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/2977003/the-latest-supported-visual-c-downloads

Plus I'd do a full Windows Update and install every last update you can.

But with this many different plugins crashing and the kinds of projects you are running you are going to have a very hard to narrowing it down.  The best you can do is update every thing, uninstall everything you don't need (system utilities/crazy apps/etc), try and narrow the crashes down to repeatable steps.  Also dump the 32-bit plugins, getting that stable with the number/variety of plugins your projects are using is almost surely a lost cause. 

I still wish there was a bright red FX on these when they are loaded  or a [32] or something - That way we would know what the risk would be.

You don't know how much I appreciate this research you did.

Thanks,

Max Arwood

 

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For the plugins you think weren't loaded, I assure you they are directly in the call stack of the crashing thread.  How they got there, only you can know that one.  The way I analyzed these is pretty mechanical.  I opened each dump file with Visual Studio and opened the debugger, and read the modules off the call stack view on the crashing thread.

Your audio card and it's Windows 7 support seem very suspect.  Not sure what you can do about that one, but it is a common theme on every project.  A newer, better supported audio interface might solve a lot of your problems.  But making those kinds of hardware changes (you'd really need to remove the PCI card and uninstall all it's drivers to be clear of it) is kind of difficult.  A good cheap USB interface can be had for well under $200 these days.

For 32 bit plugins I can't tell what they were, all you see is the bitbridge in a thread in the crash dump.  There is a VST inventory tool (search the forums) that will list out 32 bit plugins registered in Cakewalk.  I also seem to remember some utility that you could run on the Cakewalk project themselves that would list out the plugins being used in that project not sure if it can tell you about 32 bit plugins you are using.

Reverbs for specific effects can be pretty hard to narrow down.  But I'd give up on the older 32bit only stuff, no matter how perfect you think it is.  You could always sample the reverb with a convolution reverb to get something like it.  I've not had a lot of luck with that personally but the theory is pretty decent.  You might also try using jBridge instead of the Cakewalk bitbridge.  Though to be honest I don't think any of your crashes were directly due to bitbridged plugins.  it's just they tend to make projects slightly more unstable.

I wish there was some common crashing component in your crashes, those are a lot easier to assign blame.  Your problem is almost surely something outside of the Cakewalk/plugin area though -- device drivers/OS issues.

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Thanks. Yes they were there. Experimenting and forgot to remove them! I updated the Nvidia drivers they were 3 years old!  I’m sure that should help. Working with VST inventory tool. I sure wish  you could delete vsts in it!  Just doing it manually.  Fixing these two things should reduce the amount of crashes. 
 

Thanks again!

Max Arwood

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I think it was the video driver - It has been WAY better since they were updated.  Thanks for all your help. I also dumped 200 Plugins, 32bit.  Also at lease I know which ones are 32bit and can insert and freeze them. I'm excited about what is to some in 2020.  I got to get working on that dual boot!

 

Thanks again,

Max Arwood

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I've been following this thread and I'm happy the problems have been solved! It's an educational example of how important something as seemingly unrelated as video drivers can be for an audio application. Good to keep in mind!

And I'm really impressed by @Matthew Sorrels! Great work! (You don't work for Cakewalk, do you?)

Oh, it might be a good idea to add "[SOLVED]" to the title?

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I still have a small number of 32-bit plugins that I use, and what I did was to create a sub-folder within the folder all of my 32-bit plugins are in, called Bridged, and I included only that sub-folder from the 32-bit plugins main folder, in the VST search path in Cakewalk.

I would place only those 32-bit plugins that I had tested out and found to work OK in Cakewalk, into that sub-folder, so that I would then only see any 32-bit plugins that I could reasonably believe would work OK.  If I wanted to try out an additional 32-bit plugin, I would 1st copy it into that sub-folder, and then it would be able to be pulled into a test project to make sure it would work OK, and if so, then I would leave it in the sub-folder and could begin to use it in general projects, with high confidence things would work OK.

I also bought J-Bridge, as it seems more robust then the free BitBridge bridging software that comes with Cakewalk.  When I bought it, J-Bridge ran me something like $20.  It is not required, but you might find it helpful if some plugins you need don't happen to work with the free BitBridge within Cakewalk.

Bob Bone

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