Looking for room treatment advice

[jwnicholson78]

I'm looking to take my setup up a notch and replace my monitors (which were given to me years ago and aren't particularly good).  But before I do that, I'd like to add some acoustic treatment, and get as much bang for my buck as possible. 

Unfortunately, I don't have the greatest space; I'm sharing my music setup with the family basement.  And given the stuff in the basement I don't really have the option to move my setup.  It's an L-shaped room with my music computer in the back corner.  I've attached a sketch with my setup.  So I'm hoping to get advice on how to best improve my limited space.

• Above the keyboard, I have my guitars hanging from the wall.  Is that causing me problems?  Would a wall hanging behind the guitars help?
• Would wall hangings behind the music desk and the opposite wall be the way to go?  Are decorative rugs good enough, or should I invest in sound panels?
• My naive assumption would be that since I'm in the back end of an L-shaped room, standing waves are less of an issue.  The right speaker points out into the open area and one or two bounces and the left speaker and that's out in the open area two where lots of furniture and other stuff should disperse the waves, preventing standing waves.  Am I right or am I fooling myself?
• Should I get bass traps?  Where's the optimal placement and how many do I need?  Is there a way to make a measurement for the best placement?

Thanks in advance for any advice.  I really appreciate the help.

Jeff

[Byron Dickens]

I would swap the keyboard and the desk for starters. You want your monitors to be the same distance tó the walls si

Bass traps at least in the front corners (far right of your diagram. You can build broad band bass traps for far less money and that are more effective than those chunks of foam they sell masquerading as such.

Absorption on the side walls and in front of the desk.

[Lord Tim]

^^ agree with this.

Also, paging @Glenn Stanton to the thread for professional advice.

[jwnicholson78]

10 hours ago, Byron Dickens said:

I would swap the keyboard and the desk for starters. You want your monitors to be the same distance tó the walls si

Bass traps at least in the front corners (far right of your diagram. You can build broad band bass traps for far less money and that are more effective than those chunks of foam they sell masquerading as such.

Absorption on the side walls and in front of the desk.

Thanks so much for the suggestions.  I neglected to mention there is a door to right of the keyboard.  Although I drew the keyboard as centered in the drawing, it's actually not.  It's significantly closer to the music desk.  If I put the desk where the keyboard is, monitors still can't be centered and same distance to both side walls

It's definitely not an ideal space, but it's all I have so I'd like to make it work as well as I can.

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

Personally, I would shift your whole setup left until you're facing the long end of the room. You want to avoid a room with dimensions close to being square as much as possible or being too close to the front or back walls. Since your room is asymmetric, the whole corner idea for bass traps kind of falls apart, as you won't have the same reflections on both sides.

Edited May 16, 2023 by Bruno de Souza Lino

[Glenn Stanton]

it would be helpful to know where there are doors and windows, things like fire places, utilities, SAF things which cannot be moved, etc. that helps to avoid long thread of oh, i forgeot to mention the ... cannot be moved or it's a door for the neighbor, etc ?

that said - there are a few simple things to get started:

1) position for symmetry -- speakers -- start as 60° triangle (meaning from your seat they are each on 30°), and the speakers and seat form an equilateral triangle. aim the speakers to be focused about 18" behind your head and about 4-6" above your ears. 

1a) you should seat yourself about 37.5% - 39.7% distance of the length. so if you have a 20ft room, you will START at about 7' 8", depending on speakers, and so on, you'll adjust positions. seating, speakers, etc. you are looking for:

- least disruptive LF response - generally as smooth as possible - in as large a space as possible (the "sweet spot"). this means moving speakers close to the wall, farther from the walls, your seat closer, and further, etc.

- solid phantom center (assuming you're doing stereo, surround is a different thing) with symmetry so you can hear panning etc.

2) position for backwall impulses (reflected sound) to be lower than your direct speaker sound - this is the reason people tell you to shoot down the long path, but it's not always an option - so more absorption behind you to attenuate the mid and high off that back surface.

3) add some treatment on walls and ceiling for first reflection points. a simple hand mirror and laser pointer (assuming no cats around) you can quickly spot the points to hang some absorbers.

 

[Glenn Stanton]

one option is to move to the wall adjacent to your TV area and put up a baffle (wall? partition? etc) to create a symmetrical space. then treat.

[jwnicholson78]

Thanks everyone for the suggestions.  I really appreciate the willingness of people to share their expertise.  As I said in my original post, this is a family living space and given the amount of stuff in the basement, there really isn't the option to move my setup. 

But that's for the time being.  Once the kids move out in a few years, maybe I can negotiate with upper management about re-allocating space.   Then, I really like the idea of shifting left or adding baffles to be adjacent to the TV area.

For now, though, I'm stuck in the back corner where I am, so I want to make the best of what I have.

[Glenn Stanton]

where is the door on that 13ft wall?

[jwnicholson78]

Bottom right corner, right under where I've drawn the keyboard.

After I wrote me previous post, I started thinking that I really need to go back and measure everything more carefully.  Because of things like weights, kids toys, a pelaton, and spouse push-back, the front area of the L where the TV isn't a possibility.  But chances are probably good I can swap the desk and keyboard.

[Glenn Stanton]

you could still fit into your space - i'd still recommend the side partition (think cubicle wall w/ plywood ? ) SAF could even be higher since you'd now be hiding the clutter from the family's gaze... lol

on the "back wall" - a set of absorbers and a small one on the door. and one on either side of the desk.

Edited May 17, 2023 by Glenn Stanton

[Byron Dickens]

It really sucks that you are the only one who has to compromise....

[Glenn Stanton]

one interesting thing - if you put in the partition so the space is 11' wide x 13' deep, it's a decent working ratio... add some absorption and ceiling too. maybe a drape on the opening to reduce reverberant behaviour.

[Lord Tim]

I like how the rest of us give dinky suggestions and Glenn comes in with fully rendered tech drawings and acoustic measurements! ?

[jwnicholson78]

9 hours ago, Glenn Stanton said:

one interesting thing - if you put in the partition so the space is 11' wide x 13' deep, it's a decent working ratio... add some absorption and ceiling too. maybe a drape on the opening to reduce reverberant behaviour.

I love it.   I think this could work as well as swapping keyboard and desk. Thanks so much for the interesting suggestions.  I've gotten a number of ideas on how to rearrange things that I hadn't originally considered, so now I have a lot to think about.

[jwnicholson78]

9 hours ago, Byron Dickens said:

It really sucks that you are the only one who has to compromise....

Oops I may have given the wrong impression.  I want the basement to be a functional for the whole family.  I like to joke but my wife is definitely supportive.    She never complains when boxes show up on the front porch from Sweetwater

[jwnicholson78]

7 hours ago, Lord Tim said:

I like how the rest of us give dinky suggestions and Glenn comes in with fully rendered tech drawings and acoustic measurements! ?

Now I have desk envy because virtual me's desk is way cooler than mine!

Edited May 18, 2023 by jwnicholson78

[Byron Dickens]

56 minutes ago, jwnicholson78 said:

Oops I may have given the wrong impression.  I want the basement to be a functional for the whole family.  I like to joke but my wife is definitely supportive.    She never complains when boxes show up on the front porch from Sweetwater

Right on! That's good to hear.

My own wife isn't just supportive, she's an enabler!

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

On 5/17/2023 at 12:58 PM, Glenn Stanton said:

you could still fit into your space - i'd still recommend the side partition (think cubicle wall w/ plywood ? ) SAF could even be higher since you'd now be hiding the clutter from the family's gaze... lol

Which could maybe also work in favor of the "room" treatment if you make it a bass trap instead of just a "solid wall."

[Glenn Stanton]

yes, the side wall could effectively be a "gobo" that has absorption on one side and hard on the other.  i was thinking in terms of the idea that if you threw up a simple partition wall (2x3 frame, 1/2" gwb, packed with soft insulation) it would be effective as its dense enough to shape the sound pressures yet still absorb (plus the opening "vent" to further let LF "leave"), and useful later as a "room".

for the wall -- probably $300 max + 2 days elapsed between fabrication (4 hours?) and the drywall joint material to dry, then paint. (paint is likely the single most expensive individual component ? )

the actual dimensions will depend on the ceiling height - here i've assumed 8ft

 

 

 

Edited May 20, 2023 by Glenn Stanton