Z3ta

[charles kasler]

I tried out this plug-in I used years ago and it won't work with CBB. Is that because it's 32 bits? If so, perfect space still works and I think that is 32 bits. Thanks.

[abacab]

z3ta+ v1.5 is a 64-bit VST2. Works fine in CbB here.

Any 32-bit plugins in the CbB plugin browser will be shown in green text.

Edited March 8, 2023 by abacab

[charles kasler]

Thanks I'll have to check to see what version I have.

[abacab]

z3ta+ was bundled with Sonar Producer 7 thru Platinum, and may have been made available in promo editions, but I've only used the Sonar versions.

z3ta+ is included in the Platinum Instrument Collection via Cakewalk Command Center.

[charles kasler]

Thanks for yr input. I found out it works on a bus but not as an insert, for some reason. I have v1.5. It's a cool app.

[abacab]

58 minutes ago, charles kasler said:

Thanks for yr input. I found out it works on a bus but not as an insert, for some reason. I have v1.5. It's a cool app.

z3ta+ comes with 3 flavors: z3ta+.dll, z3ta+_fx.dll, and z3ta+_fx2.dll.

I've only ever used the first one, which is an instrument that loads on an instrument track. Cannot report on how to use it as an FX on a bus or insert.

Here's an old SOS article on the topic by Craig Anderton:

Using Sonar's z3ta+ Synth as an Effects Processor https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/using-sonars-z3ta-synth-effects-processor

Edited March 8, 2023 by abacab

[user 905133]

33 minutes ago, abacab said:

I've only ever used the first one, which is an instrument that loads on an instrument track. Cannot report on how to use it as an FX on a bus or insert.

I have used z3ta+ as an FX processor for years.  In fact that's the reason I didn't upgrade to z3ta+ 2 when it came out.  I haven't used it in about 1-2 years, but it worked well for me with Windows 10.  The last project I used it with, I used a Korg NanoKontrol to modify FX parameters in real time.

33 minutes ago, abacab said:

Here's an old SOS article on the topic by Craig Anderton:

Using Sonar's z3ta+ Synth as an Effects Processor https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/using-sonars-z3ta-synth-effects-processor

This describes the process.  Not 100% sure, but there might be another article, too.

UPDATE:  This might be the other article I was remembering:

Quote

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/rhythm-effects-using-sonars-z3ta-synth

 

Edited March 8, 2023 by User 905133
To add an update (with a link)

[charles kasler]

Thanks for that article, I like Craig anderton's work a lot!

[Xoo]

I just went through both of the SoS articles and couldn't get any of the (non-FX parts of z3ta) to work as described.  Anyone else tried it and been successful?

[abacab]

2 hours ago, kperry said:

I just went through both of the SoS articles and couldn't get any of the (non-FX parts of z3ta) to work as described.  Anyone else tried it and been successful?

You must use "z3ta+_fx2" for this to work. And follow the directions in the last quote below. And to hear the source from the audio track there needs to be something used as audio input, either monitoring a live audio input or playing back a wave file, similar to a vocoder setup. The sound only passes thru the plugin when you open the gate via your MIDI controller input.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/using-sonars-z3ta-synth-effects-processor

Quote

OK, this is a Sonar workshop, but after all z3ta+ is a stand-alone Cakewalk product too, and it has a feature that, ironically, doesn't work in Sonar but does work in Cubase 4: the ability to send a track's audio not just through the effects section, but through the z3ta+ filters and VCAs as well. This is possible because Cubase can assign a MIDI track to a VST plug-in effect (it doesn't just do instruments), so you can trigger the envelope generators from a keyboard.

When you install Sonar 7, it actually installs two versions of the z3ta+ effects section: z3ta+_fx and z3ta+_fx2. The one with the fx2 suffix is the one you want.

In Cubase, insert z3ta+_fx2 into the insert of a VST audio channel (of course, you should also have audio on this track, so that there's something to process). Create a MIDI track and assign its output to z3ta+_fx2. Unless you want to play the synth section at the same time, go through each oscillator and turn each wave to 'Off'. Now your MIDI keyboard can trigger the envelopes; you can play with the filter parameters, drive parameters from LFOs, and so on. Fun stuff! 

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/rhythm-effects-using-sonars-z3ta-synth

Quote

Many years ago, I wrote about using the Z3TA+ synth as an effects processor in Sonar. However, back then you couldn’t send a track through the filters and VCAs with envelope control (only through the effects), because you couldn’t assign a MIDI track to a VST plug-in. That limitation has since been remedied, so signal processing with Z3TA+ is a topic well worth revisiting —

Quote

Insert Z3TA+ in an audio track’s effects rack. Do not insert a MIDI track yet. Instead, go to Z3TA+’s header and, under the VST2 drop-down menu, choose Enable MIDI Input. Next, insert a MIDI track and assign its input to your controller of choice, and its output to Z3TA+. If you play your keyboard, you’ll hear whatever synth patch is loaded.

Unfortunately, Z3TA+’s program initialisation function doesn’t do what we need for this application, so choose a program and ‘zero’ it by at least setting all the oscillators to off and removing the modulation sources, including LFO Waves and Patterns. (Bank A, Program 032 ‘Staccato Bass’ is a good choice for a program because it’s simple, so you can zero it pretty quickly.) Also, click on the Effects button to access the effects page, set all the levels to 0, and set the EQ Mode under Equalizer/Simulator to Off. Once you’ve done that, save the program under a new name so you can call it up again in the future. To do this, double-click the program name in the header, enter a name, then click the floppy disk icon to save the program as an FXP file.

 

Edited March 15, 2023 by abacab

[Xoo]

Yep, did all that.  Nada.

[abacab]

1 hour ago, kperry said:

Yep, did all that.  Nada.

Can you provide a step by step outline of what you did?

[user 905133]

Quote

Sonar 7 installs z3ta+ as an instrument and as an audio effect. To use it as an effect, right-click in an audio track's FX bin and select z3ta+_fx.

I just verified this in CbB. Try z3ta+_fx.

• Steps I used:
  • Insert a software synth into Cakewalk.
    • I used the right-click method to insert an Instrument as an Instrument Track.
  • Insert z3ta+_fx into the Instrument Track's FX Bin.
    • Right-click FX Bin
    • Choose Insert Audio FX
    • Open Cakewalk folder [I have them sorted by manufacturer]
    • Select z3ta+ (z3ta+_fx)        VST2
    • Select EFFECTS button (lower right) in the z3ta+ UI.
    • Tweak the sound.  

For that test, I used a different soft synth. To verify that z3ta+ itself works, I deleted z3ta+_FX from the FX bin. Next, I right-clicked in the track area and replaced the synth with z3ta+ [the instrument].  It worked.

Edited March 15, 2023 by User 905133
To add more steps for z3ta+ itself. To add the steps I used just now to verify that the method mentioned in the SOS article worked for me as it has worked for years

[Xoo]

5 hours ago, abacab said:

Can you provide a step by step outline of what you did?

- Open a template project with 2 audio tracks

- Insert z3ta+ (FX2) to one of the tracks

- Enable MIDI Input in the plug-in's menu

- Add a MIDI track and route its output to z3ta+ input; use the virtual keyboard to check it triggers the synth in z3ta+ (as per Craig's article)

- Select preset A032 and zero it as per Craig's article, heading "Z3TA+ The Great"

- Set amp envelope as per article:

- Select Arp002 on arp LFO page:

- Import random audio to audio track

- Add random MIDI note to MIDI track

- Press play

Result: silence.

Bypass the FX in the FX bin and the audio plays back as expected.  From testing, I get sound through the plugin until I select an Arp pattern, at which point it stops passing audio.  It kind of works if I select Up/Down as patterns, but not the Arp patterns.  Testing a bit more, it would appear all the arps don't work (including in the regular synth VST), so something there is broken - they exist on the disk but...

Can you tell me where the arpeggio files live on your machine (they are .cmp files) in case mine have been inadvertently moved?

Aha - good old SysInternals Process Monitor to the rescue: C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\z3ta+\Arpeggios - they were in my ProgramData folder...

Edited March 15, 2023 by kperry

[user 905133]

Are you saying this is what you used to do before SONAR became Cakewalk by Bandlab and now it doesn't do the same thing that it used to do?  If I understand what you did/are trying to do, it sounds wild enough for me to want to try it!!!  I never applied Z3ta+ effects to audio and then tried to use MIDI to run the audio through the synth engine, and the arpeggiator function, too.

One thing I tried to do was use CC64 to lock in arps, but I could never get that to work.  CC64 just sustained the note; it did not latch the arpeggiator.  I assumed that it didn't work like that and just used it either as a synth or as an FX processor.  

I am sure that after 2016 (when the second SOS article came out) I did not go back and retry it.

UPDATE:   I got it [Craig's 2016 basic method to make the audio track to be triggered by the arp pattern] to work.  I was impatient and so I only did it part way before testing.  No Sound.  ?  Then I moved the linked Cutoff frequencies up and I got sound.  ? 

I copied the text from the article into Notepad and crudely reformatted it into steps so I could make sure I was doing each step as I went along.  If you can't get Craig's method to work for you, I can try to make my notepad set of steps less ideosyncratic tomorrow.

For now, I just wanted to verify that I was able to get my audio track to pass through audio based on z3ta+_fx2's zeroed + arp gate preset.  Thanks for suggesting this.

 

Edited March 16, 2023 by User 905133
To add an Update ;To add a comment after looking at the date of the second article.

[abacab]

Don't forget to open up the filter cutoff!

 

Edited March 16, 2023 by abacab

[user 905133]

14 hours ago, User 905133 said:

UPDATE:   I got it [Craig's 2016 basic method to make the audio track to be triggered by the arp pattern] to work.  I was impatient and so I only did it part way before testing.  No Sound.  ?  Then I moved the linked Cutoff frequencies up and I got sound.  ? [emphasis added]

1 hour ago, abacab said:

Don't forget to open up the filter cutoff!

  I guess I should have emphasized that in my post.  BTW, I referred to "linked" intentionally (i.e., not casually), but maybe that also needed to be emphasized.  Clearly kperry did not follow all the instructions , but I didn't want to overly emphasize that to an extreme.  ? 

 

[Mister Cakewalk sonar]

I have a more general question, Groove synth, Z3ta1, TTS-1, Dimension, Cakewalk Rapture, RgcAudio Pentagon, are they free ? where can I download them?

[InstrEd]

Only if you have a cakewalk.com account can you download your old software. If you didn't buy back then , out of luck. Sonar platinumcame with some of the software you listed and you are allowed to download and use by the generosity of Bandlab.  If you're new to Cakewalk then no currently you don't get the goodies. I still love Z3TA ❤️

[Mister Cakewalk sonar]

I installed cakewalk Bandlab for free from the site through the installer, but what about these plugins? maybe after years they are free? Z3TA 2, what's wrong with her now?