Midi keyboard issue

[Will.]

I've  been away from CbB and there's some great new updates that happened! Switching the keyboard on after starting up the DAW - CbB does not pick it up. I have to close it and fire it back up. I would like add: This is a brand new clean install of OS and DAW about a week old. 

[Byron Dickens]

That is normal.

[Will.]

It shouldn't be.

So im only noticing this now? ? Well, theres a request for someone I guess. 

[David Baay]

No, it's not normal for this to not be working. It's working as usual with my MIDI interface in the current release.  That said, I have occasionally seen auto-detection fail to display the pop-up, but I'm inclined to lay the blame on Windows not signaling the driver load properly.

[Will.]

That's what I know yes. Did a test again and it is still doing it. The pop up window appears I click yes, but nothing assigns. I actually just fired up CbB to export some files to transfer to a different DAW. This is the first time after months that I am installing CbB again. It was completely removed from my machines, but I'm really happy to see things are still happening here. 

I'm loving the new updates and improvements though. Oh-well. 

[David Baay]

2 hours ago, Will. said:

The pop up window appears I click yes, but nothing assigns.

Are the keyboard MIDI ports enabled in Preferences > MIDI > Devices?

Is it working if the keyboard is powered up before CbB is launched?

[Will.]

10 hours ago, David Baay said:

Is it working if the keyboard is powered up before CbB is launched?

Yes. 

10 hours ago, David Baay said:

Are the keyboard MIDI ports enabled in Preferences > MIDI > Devices?

It unchecks the boxes when switching the Midi Keyboard on after CbB is fired up. 

[David Baay]

8 hours ago, Will. said:

It unchecks the boxes when switching the Midi Keyboard on after CbB is fired up. 

Hmmm... that's a new one on me. Some typical things to check/try:

- Are you using MME driver mode (MIDI > Playback and Recording, not Audio),

- Any chance the keyboard was moved to a different USB port at some point?

- Is it in a USB2 port?

- Ar the ports assigned as a Control Ssurface when not intended?

- Any onboard MIDI devices or other oddness shown in Device Manager?

- Disable anti-virus. or exclude driver paths.

- Rename TTSSEQ.INI and have CbB build a new one.

 

 

Edited August 8, 2022 by David Baay

[Xoo]

ttsseq.ini not set to read-only (I've done that intentionally on my setup to prevent some weird port reordering).

[John Vere]

I have observed this behaviour in the past. It’s like this for me-

Roland controller has a Roland midi driver and can be turned off and on with out issues. It always works and this goes back 15 years  

Akai Controller uses a Microsoft generic midi driver and it requires I re boot Cakewalk or it doesn’t show. 

Yamaha DX drums have a Yamaha Midi driver and they behave just like the Roland. They can be turned off and on no problem. 
 

Conclusion is that factory supplied Midi drivers are sort of like Factory supplied audio drivers. They are better 

Edited August 8, 2022 by Cactus Music

[Will.]

1 hour ago, David Baay said:

Hmmm... that's a new one on me. Some typical things to check/try:

- Are you using MME driver mode (MIDI > Playback and Recording, not Audio),

- Any chance the keyboard was moved to a different USB port at some point?

- Is it in a USB2 port?

- Ar the ports assigned as a Control Ssurface when not intended?

- Any onboard MIDI devices or other oddness shown in Device Manager?

- Disable anti-virus. or exclude driver paths.

- Rename TTSSEQ.INI and have CbB build a new one.

 

 

It's on a brand new installation of windows 10 and CbB. I'm not much stressed or worried about it. I'm not using CbB lately. I'm on Mac and a different DAW for "professional" work. 

Edited August 8, 2022 by Will.

[Will.]

49 minutes ago, Cactus Music said:

Conclusion is that factory supplied Midi drivers are sort of like Factory supplied audio drivers. They are better 

This goes for Microsoft too. So . . . what's the answer to your observation John? ??

[Will.]

1 hour ago, Kevin Perry said:

ttsseq.ini not set to read-only (I've done that intentionally on my setup to prevent some weird port reordering).

I will keep this in mind when I fire CbB back on again when ever. Would be nice to have the baker let the DAW fix this automatically, or not! 

After firing CbB up after many-many moons, I immediately gave a sigh and though "BUG." and instantly discouraged. 

[John Vere]

Like I say, my very limited observation with the disconnection issue.

The 2 Controllers that have a Factory written Midi driver always connect. 

The Controller that uses a Generic Midi driver needs me to re boot Cakewalk to get it to connect. 

I should borrow a few of my Sons Controllers and see if my theory holds water.  

Interestingly the Roland driver was updated by Windows updates.  That's nice. I no longer have to keep checking the web site for updates. Not that I ever did because Midi drivers are sort of off my radar most days. Then the Yamaha DX drum brain has a habit of falling asleep after only 10 minutes. So it's a good thing it reconnects without fuss. I need to get out the manual and fix that. 

[Will.]

16 minutes ago, Cactus Music said:

Interestingly the Roland driver was updated by Windows updates.  That's nice. I no longer have to keep checking the web site for updates. Not that I ever did 

??

18 minutes ago, Cactus Music said:

The Controller that uses a Generic Midi driver needs me to re boot Cakewalk to get it to connect. 

This is the problem I have, yes. For some reason I can't recall this ever happened to me before. Cakewalk always used to assigned after it has prompt for it. Now it doesn't and like you've said - a reboot of CbB is required. 

[David Baay]

What keyboard? Does it not have a vendor-supplied driver?

I've never had a physical MIDI device that didn't have a dedicated driver so wouldn't ever have seen this.

[Will.]

11 hours ago, David Baay said:

What keyboard? Does it not have a vendor-supplied driver?

I've never had a physical MIDI device that didn't have a dedicated driver so wouldn't ever have seen this.

Sanchez 49 USB Keystation. No, it doesnt. Logic picks it up in an instant even PT first. I can easily switch it on and off while the DAW is fired up. I can swore Cakewalk used to do it - I might be incorrect too. 

[msmcleod]

Cakewalk relies on Windows telling it a MIDI device has been connected or disconnected.  If the Windows notification doesn't come through, Cakewalk won't know about it.  More often than not (at least on my system), disconnected devices are recognised immediately, but some newly connected devices can take up to 30 secs to be recognised.

I find it much easier to:

1. Ensure you always use the same USB ports for all your MIDI devices.
2. Ensure your MIDI devices are connected and switched on before you boot your PC up, so the MIDI device number Windows gives it is consistent each time.
3. If given the choice between a USB and 5-pin DIN connector, I always go for the 5-pin DIN - this allows me to switch off the synth/controller,  but the port itself is always on.  Of course you do need a good multi-port MIDI interface for this...  the Miditech Midiface 8x8 has been rock solid for me.

[EDIT] - Regarding class compliant MIDI interfaces vs ones with their own drivers...  for the most part, MIDI interfaces with dedicated drivers have performed better for me in the past.  However, they will reach a point where the drivers will stop working with the latest OS, as was the case with my Midisport 8x8.  

The main issue with a lot of class compliant MIDI interfaces (i.e. ones that just rely on Microsoft drivers) is that they receive MIDI data at USB speeds (i.e. 480Mbps for USB2), but send the data out at 31.25K, which is obviously much slower. In order to do this they need to "hold back" to the received MIDI data by storing it internally so they can send it out at a slower speed. 

Cheaper MIDI interfaces (esp the USB MIDI "cables") have a VERY small internal buffer, and will not cope with buffering SysEx or even controller/pitch wheel events in some cases. This results in stuck/lost notes, and will not cope with even a modest sysex load.

Even though the Midiface is class compliant, I've not had this issue with them, so it obviously has a reasonably sized internal buffer.

 

[Will.]

56 minutes ago, msmcleod said:

Cakewalk relies on Windows telling it a MIDI device has been connected or disconnected.  If the Windows notification doesn't come through, Cakewalk won't know about it.  More often than not (at least on my system), disconnected devices are recognised immediately, but some newly connected devices can take up to 30 secs to be recognised.

Microsoft recognise it every time. Yet, I still have to manually reselect the USB midi keyboard little box in preferences when switching it on and off  while Cakewalk is running. 

It's not an issue. I probably have gotten used to MacOS Big Sur doing things automatically - e.g. there's a lot of drivers Microsoft requires my gear to use - which MacOS don't require at all - not even for two interfaces I own, which is clearly stated on the manufactures website. So, I don't mean to make this an issue.