getting reverb onto delay echoes/repeats

[jonathan]

I have a routing question regarding putting reverb on the delay repeats without affecting the original audio.

My typical set up is to insert a reverb plugin on a bus, and a delay plugin on another bus; then I set up sends on my instrument track – one send to the reverb bus and another to the delay bus (in that order). But what I find is that the delay echoes can sound unnatural because they are dry – there is no reverb on them. They sound unnatural because the audio in the track is wet with reverb, and so you get a wet vocal with dry echoes/repeats.

I tried using the send on the delay bus to go to the reverb bus and this worked – my echoes were wet with reverb, but it actually affects the instrument track original signal as well, so you get twice as much reverb – you get reverb from the reverb send, and more reverb on the delay send.

So I am wondering, how do you route the audio so that you can get reverb only on the delay repeats without re-applying reverb to the original audio signal?

[Kev]

5 hours ago, Dilaco said:

...I tried using the send on the delay bus to go to the reverb bus and this worked – my echoes were wet with reverb, but it actually affects the instrument track original signal as well, so you get twice as much reverb – you get reverb from the reverb send, and more reverb on the delay send.

So I am wondering, how do you route the audio so that you can get reverb only on the delay repeats without re-applying reverb to the original audio signal?

That shouldn't happen if you have set it up correctly. I suspect that your delay fx plugin is not set to 100% wet.

[chuckebaby]

When ever possible (with me its 90% of the time) ...

- Reverbs and Delays are controlled by sends via FX Bus.

- EQ and compression are put on tracks.

There are those times, for example: I have reverb in the FX bin of my snare track, guitar track, a second delay on vocals but for the most part I leave Modulation FX for Buses.

If you really must have this reverberated delay and it doesn't sound natural using realtime FX.. You could try bouncing down the wet track and then running it through the second FX.

 

[Terry Kelley]

Whenever I need something unique I either add it to the track or set up a new feed/send into the main bus. I often have tracks thest have their own delay and reverb too.

Edited February 24, 2019 by Awats

[jonathan]

Thanks for your input guys.

Kev, you said ‘that shouldn’t happen if you set it up correctly’. I think you’re right. I set it up again in a demo file, and with the reverb send on the delay bus the delays were wet and the original signal was left dry. Now I have to find out the variable, because the last time I set this up the reverb send on the delay bus definitely affected the original signal, which is why I posted.

I keep a personal manual of Sonar that I write in my own words so that whenever I discover something new or work something out I have a reference that I can look up. Some time ago I had written in there that a reverb send on the delay bus won’t affect the original signal—that it will only affect the delay repeats. I thought I had been wrong, but after setting up the routing again I realize I was right. So, what I did differently to make the reverb affect the original signal the other day I don’t know, as I forget which file I was working on when this happened.

[Slugbaby]

To me, it sounds like putting the Reverb and Delay on the same track, in series, is what you want to do.

If you leave the original track dry, you may have to individually mess with the wet/dry on each effect to get it to the right balance before adjusting the buss volume to meet the original.

 

[seran seran]

On 2/24/2019 at 2:04 PM, Chuck E Baby said:

When ever possible (with me its 90% of the time) ...

- Reverbs and Delays are controlled by sends via FX Bus.

- EQ and compression are put on tracks.

There are those times, for example: I have reverb in the FX bin of my snare track, guitar track, a second delay on vocals but for the most part I leave Modulation FX for Buses. HostGator DreamHost Bluehost

If you really must have this reverberated delay and it doesn't sound natural using realtime FX.. You could try bouncing down the wet track and then running it through the second FX.

 

Whenever I need something unique I either add it to the track or set up a new feed/send into the main bus. I often have tracks thest have their own delay and reverb too.

Edited February 26, 2019 by seran seran

[Terry Kelley]

I was thinking you could add two master buses, one with reverb and one with echo. The echo could feel the reverb. That way you can have reverb with and without echo. This assumes you want the reverb to be same either way.

[jonathan]

I found the file where the problem occurred. Kev, you were absolutely right, the wet-dry was at 50%. When set to 100% the direct signal is unaffected by the reverb send on the delay bus.

The reason I had not suspected this is because I normally have the delay plugin defaulting to 100% wet, but in this file I was using a relatively new acquisition: the Soundtoys Echoboy Jr., which defaults to a wet/dry setting of 50%.

So, all is good with the routing now. Thanks everyone.