Old skool vs New Skool editing.

[Will.]

1 hour ago, rsinger said:

Guess I'm still confused. Are you saying using plugins is new skool?

Read Mr. Craig Anderton's reply. ?

[rsinger]

I'll buy that ...

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

I don't see a distinction , it's all just a means to an end

[Sailor55]

On the subject of hiding tracks: On most projects I often have about as many hidden tracks as I do visible ones. I keep original versions of any tracks sent to me by others and typically work only on copies. I move all hidden tracks to the top of the track view. So, if the first visible  track is number 12, I know there are 11 hidden tracks.

Also, I archive all hidden tracks. That way they can't possibly interfere with my project. (For example, if I were to accidentally un-mute one or more hidden tracks).  Also, archived tracks remain unprocessed (i.e. ignored) by Cakewalk. I once had a project with many, many hidden audio tracks. It took a long time for the project to  start after clicking 'play'. I was getting an annoying delay of up to two seconds before the project would sound because all the hidden tracks were only muted and still needed to be processed (somehow), even if they didn't sound.

After a project is finished I'll usually delete any hidden files that I'm quite sure I'll never need.

[micv]

fun topic but what is the definition or assumption of old/new school?

[Bapu]

"Everything old is new again" ~Steven Paige, Barenaked Ladies

[Will.]

5 hours ago, Sailor55 said:

. I move all hidden tracks to the top of the track view. So, if the first visible  track is number 12, I know there are 11 hidden tracks.

 

Why don't you just throw all your hidden tracks in a folder? Much easier and convenient. ?

[Starship Krupa]

On 5/15/2020 at 5:47 AM, msmcleod said:

If I'm getting rid of bleed or rumbles in silence, I'll permanently remove it. Same with any pitch or timing correction. My reasoning being that if it sounded bad enough to need to be edited, then there's no way I'd want to keep the original... though if it's someone else's performance, I'll just keep a backup of the original files. In saying that, I'm much more likely to re-record a bad take than resort to editing.

The end result is a much simpler session to work with, less plugins/automation, and much less strain on my CPU.

Whoa. This is an example of why it's great for me to read these threads. Yes, of course. A workflow change here. Once I've edited out the breaths and lip smacks and whatevers, or put on some iZotope RX7 De-Clip for a live recording or whatever,  why do I need to burden the DAW with keeping track of all the clips and making it process it every time when I can bounce to clip and then it's just a nice clean audio file with all my edits in place? ?‍♂️

Of course, we all must choose the point at which we do this, for me it would be once I've done the basic cleanup, finished comping, if any.

On 5/18/2020 at 2:59 PM, micv said:

fun topic but what is the definition or assumption of old/new school?

This. When the OP first said it, I thought of tape and splicing blocks! How old a skool are we talking about here?

Now from what I gather, he means printing FX vs. recording dry and then using plug-ins ITB? If so, put me in the new skool camp. My plug-ins are way better than any of my outboard gear, and having a totally dry capture to work with affords the ultimate flexibility.

I'm still learning the art of being a mix engineer, my skills improve every time I sit down with a project and start messing around with compressor and EQ settings, trying different things I learn from online tutorials, etc. Having raw stems to work with is best. I'm just a hobbyist, to me it's another instrument I'm learning to play. Every once in a while I get together something that I think is good enough to play for my friends. Maybe months from now I'll put it up on YouTube and Soundcloud, when I get enough material, Bandcamp.

On 5/18/2020 at 2:33 PM, Sailor55 said:

I archive all hidden tracks. That way they can't possibly interfere with my project. (For example, if I were to accidentally un-mute one or more hidden tracks).  Also, archived tracks remain unprocessed (i.e. ignored) by Cakewalk. I once had a project with many, many hidden audio tracks. It took a long time for the project to  start after clicking 'play'. I was getting an annoying delay of up to two seconds before the project would sound because all the hidden tracks were only muted and still needed to be processed (somehow), even if they didn't sound

This is a very good strategy. One thing that is happening is that even for lanes and clips and entire tracks that are muted, Cakewalk still streams their associated audio files from disk every time you start the transport. Even when there is no unmuted audio associated with the file, it still gets streamed. I don't know why. I was having the same issue you were with the transport delay and did some investigation using Windows' Resource Monitor.

It's only when the clips are within archived tracks that they stop being streamed from disk, so when I have many alternate takes in a project that I want to keep for whatever reason (maybe I notice a week later that there's a blown phrase in a vocal and I want to bring it in from another take), I move them to another track and then archive the track, as you do.

I and others have made a feature request that takes can be archived, so we'll see where that goes.

[fantini]

Starship Krupa is right.  Old school might be a razor and tape. I wonder what old school was before those days. One thing for sure, there were vacuum tubes involved.

[chuckebaby]

I try to use the same tools i was using in the 1980's when i first started mixing. Back then editing was all about cutting tape and i spent hours at times splicing stuff up to create good takes. Now i try to apply that same mentality to digital. it is much faster now, but still the same process in many ways.

[Will.]

13 hours ago, fantini said:

I wonder what old school was before those days. 

You're missing the point. A lot of techniques that was used in the golden era, don't get used today anymore - with digital recording taking over. When last did you create your own chorus effect without a plugin - if you can.

When last have you used only your ears to mix with no monitor for visual purpose, or a reverb room? There's 1000's of new mixing ideas out there - 100's on sidechain - but why is that? 

Just like how we moved from MONO to STEREO. These old techniques are changing too. Take me for instance. I'm in my early 30's. My career started in the digital world back in 2008. Learning from legends in my country and working with international engineers - I've come to love mixing in MONO before putting everything back in STEREO. It  just sounds cleaner. Remember "Flanger?" Wow - Do i still love that! 90% of video's on Youtube is pure digital world, digital techniques. How many of them give you the WHY, WHERE and "WHAT-if's?"  Like Mr. Anderton said, it's only the "HOW TO" with digital. 

This thread is just to help those that is just starting out with their career or "hobby" and to help them understand where everything in digital exist from today and why.

 

Edited May 20, 2020 by Will_Kaydo

[chuckebaby]

52 minutes ago, Will_Kaydo said:

You're missing the point. A lot of techniques that was used in the golden era don't get used today anymore, with digital recording taking over. When last did you create your own chorus effect without a plugin - if you can.

When last have you used only your ears to mix with no monitor for visual purpose, or a reverb room? There's 1000's of new mixing ideas out there - 100's on sidechain - but why is that? 

you bring up some good points Will.

Its been a while for me too. New habits die hard just like old ones. Every once in a while i still have to remind myself to close my eyes and listen and not look at wave forms on my monitor.

Edited May 20, 2020 by chuckebaby

[msmcleod]

One of the other ways I translate my "old skool" ways to working in the box...

I try to make a distinction between tracking, mixing and mastering.  IMO it's far too easy/convenient to blur these when working with a DAW, when in fact I actually  find it makes things more complicated as you move further along the process.

If I've tracked an instrument by going straight through the DI, I'll then spend some time using a channel strip, compressor, EQ etc to get the sound I want for that instrument. This I always do in solo because at this point I'm essentially doing sound design.  In the old days, I'd have done this before it went to tape (i.e. though preamps/console/outboard)... but now I can do it after I've recorded it by adding the "tracking" console emulation afterwards. Once the sound is what I want, I'll bounce it so all I've got is a clean track.

I'll do that with all my tracks, so I've got a clean slate to work from for mixing.

If I didn't do this, there would be possible confusion between which plugins are sound-design, and which plugins are for mixing - not to mention the extra CPU load.

Then I mix...

Once I've done my mix, I bounce to a stereo track and master ONLY on that stereo track.