norfolkmastering

Thanks for the explanation Mark, it's really useful to better understand this stuff. I don't want to have to use two hardware profiles but my larger hardware system (which I use when working in hybrid analogue/digital mode) uses six MOTU ultralites plus two hardware controllers, which is pretty well on the edge of what Windows/Firewire/Sonar copes with. It's a bit clunky! So for composing I use a single MOTU unit which is not practical to power at the same time as the full set up (I tried, but seven Firewire connected devices was too much for Windows to cope with). So I connect the single MOTU by USB and then only power up the MOTU units I am going to use. The work-a-round, once the desired hardware set up is powered up, is to reboot Windows before firing up Sonar. This seems to bring the Sonar boot-up time back down to normal (using the appropriate custom hardware profile). This ties in with your comments about Windows remembering the previous set up. My intention is to move to three MOTU 16As but I can't find a MIDI router to replace the MIDI ports I currently get from the ultralites. I've tried two MIDI routers but they all seem to struggle to work in multi-client mode (which I need). The ultralites do work okay in MIDI multi-client mode due to the Firewire interface. Once the new Windows 11 MIDI Services release is made public (sometime in 2025) I should have a way forward with the MIDI router issue. It promises (fingers crossed!) to offer multi-client support for any current MIDI router with Windows Class Compliant drivers. It is also going to offer what I currently have to use MIDI-OX and loopMIDI for (MIDI routing and virtual MIDI ports). I'm going to test all of that as soon as the public release is available.

Thanks for the suggestion. I've had a go at creating two hardware profiles. See I have taken your suggestion a stage further: With hardware set 1 powered up, I deleted both aud.ini and ttsseq.ini Then I started Sonar. Checked I was happy with settings (e.g. pan law) then saved as a custom hardware config which can be loaded as part of a customised Sonar shortcut. Next I powered down and then power up with hardware set 2. Again I deleted aud.ini and ttsseq.ini and loaded Then I started Sonar (from the standard shortcut). Again checked I was happy with the settings and saved as a second custom hardware config with its own customised Sonar shortcut. This means that the aud.ini and ttsseq.ini files only contain the audio and midi listings of the hardware for their related hardware. I'm still experimenting so I'll let you now if that solves my slow Sonar loading issue.

Yes I've checked my "open all devices" is not checked. I found an earlier discussion about this whole topic at

I created two hardware profiles today and I am getting messages that they are being successfully applied. Due to MOTU driver limitations, I only power up the audio/MIDI interfaces for the profile I want to load. When switching between hardware profiles (which in my case means after powering down the PC and interfaces) the first loading of Sonar is extremely slow (at least 50 seconds after the SONAR splash screen appears). After that the loading time is much faster for the same profile. I have a couple of questions: 1. When you save a new hardware profile does it simply make a copy the AUD.INI file which was used when loading Sonar with the default profile? 2. Should I have deleted the default AUD.INI file before loading Sonar with the default profile BEFORE creating the custom profiles? I am trying to understand why Sonar is struggling to load when changing profiles?

Do you mean the ‘new’ Sonar? The link seems to be from the legacy documentation? Is there any up to date documentation on how to use hardware profiles?

It would be great if the Sonar dev team could confirm what’s possible with the current release. I’ve found a few other posts of folks with similar issues when changing hardware configurations.

I've had a look through the Preferences menu but the only 'Advanced' item I can find is File\Advanced. I can't see anything to do with profiles there. There are some options under Customization\Backup/Restore Settings which might be what you are referring to? It doesn't seem to include a means to set the command line switch but that may be my lack of understanding! If you get a chance to check and give me a few tips on how to set this up, that would be great.

I just raised a new post about this topic here Was the easier way to switch between hardware profiles every implemented?

This morning I powered up and loaded my main set up (after having powered down yesterday after a session with my composing set up (see above). The six MOTU audio interfaces were recognised fine by the MOTU app but Sonar struggled to get past the first SONAR screen. Previously it has taken up to a minute to get past this initial screen but today it won't at all. Did a PC reboot and Sonar started after about 45 secs. Sonar seems to struggle with changed audio interface hardware so your thoughts on this and my previous post would be welcome.

Thanks for the info, really useful. I've been reading up on the new Windows 11 support for MIDI, so it looks like a solution for me when the public release happens later this year. It looks like it provides: - multi-client support - MIDI routing (like you can do using MIDI-OX) - Virtual MIDI ports (similar to loopMIDI) They claim it will work with any existing MIDI router which is Windows class compliant. So that means that a MIDI router like the miditech MIDIFAC 8x8 should work with Sonar and my external hardware controllers. We shall see!

I got the software for my custom hardware controllers updated. It works but the MOTU micro light MIDI router is not very reliable when used multi client (Sonar and MIDI-OX). So I’m back on the lookout for a true multi client MIDI router. Has anyone had experience of the new Window 11 multi client drivers? I think they support MIDI as well so that may be the way to solve my issue.

I have two setups when using Sonar. My composing set up has a single MOTU 828mk3 Hybrid USB audio interface and no external hardware controllers. Recording is all digital. My main recording and mixdown set up has six MOTU ultralite mk3 Firewire audio interfaces and two external hardware controllers with a complex MIDI routing arrangement via MIDI-OX. This is used with a lot of audio I/O in a hybrid digital/analogue set up with tape machines. Recording is digital, analogue or both. Both run from the same PC. I only power up the hardware I am going to use for a session. If I power everything up, then the total loading of seven MOTU units and the controllers and the MIDI stuff begins to cause the whole system to struggle. If I've been using the main set up and then next day power up the composing set up, Sonar is quite slow to load and of course I get the warning that two controllers could not be connected to. Occasionally I get problems with random changing of audio sampling rate and have to power down and back up again to get it all sorted. Is there any way to store two set ups in Sonar so that switching between my composing and main recording set ups could be easier, load faster and be less prone to hiccups? I know that the Cakewalk stores some information about the audio interfaces in AUD.INI so I was wondering if I could have two versions of that, one for each set up? Or is there another way?

I think I got to the bottom of the problems I had with the micro lite. It doesn't like another MOTU USB MIDI driver being loaded as well as its own (I had the ultralite USB drivers loaded) That got it up and running reliably. The next issue was that the MOTU micro lite appears to be outputting all normal MIDI messages (including CCs) in MIDI Running Status mode. This means that the Status Byte is only transmitted once until there is a change of Status Byte value. I was amazed to find this on a USB MIDI interface. So my custom external controllers were not programmed to deal with this and were getting well and truly confused! I have worked out how to change the controller software to deal with MIDI running status so I guess I will do the work as I like the micro lite and it does work with both Sonar and MIDI-OX simultaneously.

I've messaged them to double check whether their MIDI interfaces will do the job for me. I'm also going to have a look at the new Windows MIDI Services drivers to see if that's a route I should explore. Does anyone have knowledge or usage of these new drivers?

I just spent some hours testing the MOTU micro lite 5x5 MIDI interface. Although I was able to select ports simultaneously on Sonar and MIDI-OX, operation during dual-client use was not reliable. Sometime it failed to pass SysEx, sometime it scrambled CCs, just not right. So I have reverted back to the MIDIs on my multiple MOTU ultralites. These work reliably under dual-client use. My search for a 5x5 (or bigger) MIDI interface with true multi-client operation under Windows continues ... Suggestions welcome!