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Olaf

75 workflow improvements to make Cakewalk more intuitive (+ appearance, implementation, etc.)

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13 minutes ago, Teegarden said:

Thanks for the clear answer!

I guess that's not the case when your PC power profile is set to maximum performance all the time (and good cooling to avoid throtling)?

And what is the influence of the soundcard regarding latency?
I've got a ten year old RME PCIe AIO card that gives effective latency of 2.7 ms with 256 buffer, 24bit, 96kHz, 64 bit double precision buffer (ASIO reported latencies:  input 3.1, output 3.7, total roundtrip 6.8ms). That seem relatively good figures to me (working without glitches when all unnecessary background processes are eliminated)? 

And the fastest PCIe 4.0 SSD's? Don't they also improve latency? The 10900k has only PCIe 3.0...

I agree regarding the cost/performance of the 10900k, but I'm quite interested in the new AMD, will just wait till its available at reasonable price🙂

Power profile is certainly part of the equation... but not all of it.   

CPU cooler has to be able to keep up (or course).

 

Your audio interface determines the latency your DAW can achieve.

The CPU has to be able to sustain the load (glitch-free)... but has no direct affect on the actual latency figure.

 

6.8ms total round-trip latency isn't bad.

If you want lowest possible round-trip latency, Presonus Quantum can achieve sub 1ms (96k using a 16-sample ASIO buffer size).

Right now, only the 10900k can sustain any type of load at those settings... and that's do to the super high clock-speed (5.3GHz).

 

PCIe 4.0 SSDs have zero impact on audio latency.

PCIe 3.0 SSDs sustain 3500MB/Sec.

PCIe 4.0 SSD sustain about 4000-5000MB/Sec.

 

You may be surprised to hear that the 5950x is currently performing slightly better with the B550 vs. X570 chipset.

X570 is also active-cooled... which means small (annoying) high-RPM fan.  Noisy!

 

5950x is an $800 CPU.  

If you're waiting for significant discount, it's going to be an extended wait.  😉

 

 

 

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On 1/26/2021 at 12:59 AM, Teegarden said:

've managed to improve performance by tweaking my Threadripper system to the max, but at the cost of way too many unproductive hours and now my hardware is starting to wear out. So now, when I can finally record something decent, I might need to replace things again🤔

Yeap, been there, done that, repeatedly.

On 1/26/2021 at 12:59 AM, Teegarden said:

My impression is that we are in the minority group (most users seem to be reasonably satisfied, Intel systems...?)

I think if you add up all the report topics in the feedback or product related topics, and those on social media groups, it's gonna come up that we're not that much of a minority, after all. It also depends on how everyone uses it - how much it pushes it, customizes it, how many plugins, etc.

On 1/26/2021 at 12:59 AM, Teegarden said:

explaining that separate plugin sandboxing like in other DAWs is not a solution in the end

It seems to work, though. It certainly stops the crashing problems, which is essential, especially if they happen often, and an extra 3 ms of latency induced in a high plugin count project doesn't seem to be a make or break factor, particularly since we're all bound to transition to newer platforms as hardware improves.

I think if that's what sandboxing costs, latency wise, as per the article you posted about Ardour, that will be a more than doable tradeoff. In my experience you can work with up to maybe 15 ms roundtrip, when recording - when mixing even more. I think where you lose the most, latency wise, is in the engine, and in the hardware, like you said.

On the other hand, I don't know how sandboxing can be optimized even further, or if there are better alternatives, but I really do think something must be done to stop the crashes. Even if you don't lose stuff, it's incredibly off putting. If you add the various settings that you need to redo on every project load, because CW doesn't save them - or some plugins, like with certain low range values in the compressor release times of CLA Mixhub, for instance - which is great, otherwise - it's enough to make you want to quit for the night. If it happens two-three times, you're really out of it. And then you have to record, and you're already pissed off.

On 1/26/2021 at 12:59 AM, Teegarden said:

Did I mention that I have 32GB RAM so I switched of my paging file?

I still have mine - 16 GB. I've made it smaller - 1 GB, but haven't tried disabling it completely, to compare. What I've read mostly recommended leaving it on, so I left it on.

I haven't tried overclocking because I don't know how to mess with the voltages, and I didn't put in the time to read enough about it until now. I didn't imagine it you make that much of a difference to actually delve in it. How much of a difference, percentage wise, would you say you've got?

On 1/26/2021 at 12:59 AM, Teegarden said:

Anyway, there's a shortages of the top Ryzen CPUs, so they are overprized at the moment. I think that in about 4 months prizes and availability will be better. Thinking about the Ryzen 5900X or 5950X + 128 GB 3600 RAM.

You've got big plans. That sounds good. But do you think you'll need all that RAM? Personally, for me, even with other stuff open, my most loaded project doesn't seem to push the RAM beyond 50-60%, with 16 GB, so I don't worry about that, for the moment.

I think you're right about the availability, and the prices seem to be catching up to Intel, pound per pound, more than I'd like to - there's still a notable difference, but not as much as there used to be. On the other hand I don't want to switch to an all Intel platform not only because of the performance/cost ratio, which is still, in my opinion, noticeably favorable to AMD, but because I know AMD better than Intel, and I don't want to spend days understanding Intel, to know what to get - especially since the name codes seem to have to connection with the number of cores, generations, etc. - or I can't easily decode them, anyway.

I won't hurry to get the new CPU for a few months. I've gotten the new NVME SSD this month - huge transfer rate difference vs a 2.5 SSD, but since I can't boot off it, I can't compare it in terms of system speed. I'll get the motherboard next month, the RAM the month after, and see where the CPU prices are in about April, it's probably the best thing to do.

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On 1/26/2021 at 4:39 PM, Jim Roseberry said:

At this point, CPU use (demand) is extremely low... so the system decides to throttle CPU clock-speed down to 1/4 speed... as well as parking several cores.

When the stripped-down bridge ends, here comes the massive chorus-out-vamp.  Huge stacks of backing vocals, synths, etc.

That massive CPU load now falls on the CPU running at 1/4 clock-speed... with several cores that have been parked.

Hey, @Jim Roseberry, thanks for your extended answer.

There are some utilities, and registry changes you can make to permanently unpark all cores - it's one of the first things I do on a fresh Win install. Some links you can try.

https://itechviral.com/enable-or-disable-cpu-core-parking-in-windows-10/

https://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/CPU-Tweak/CPU-Unpark.shtml

https://www.craigthetechteacher.com/how-to-disable-cpu-core-parking-in-windows-10-2020/

There's also disabling some of the C states or motherboard power saving utilities in BIOS, that might help.

On 1/26/2021 at 4:39 PM, Jim Roseberry said:

The new 5950x (Vermeer) is the first series of AMD CPUs where that's finally been resolved.

I imagine that's the case for the entire 5xxx series, including the 58xx, right?

On 1/26/2021 at 6:38 PM, Jim Roseberry said:

You may be surprised to hear that the 5950x is currently performing slightly better with the B550 vs. X570 chipset.

X570 is also active-cooled... which means small (annoying) high-RPM fan.  Noisy!

Are you referring to the overall performance, or only the noise? I was looking at 570 motherboards for a new 5800X.

 

Edited by Olaf

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On 1/30/2021 at 9:17 AM, Olaf said:

Are you referring to the overall performance, or only the noise? I was looking at 570 motherboards for a new 5800X.

 

Performance is slightly better with B550 vs X570... and no additional noise.  

I'm not interested in lower-end Vermeer CPUs... as the clock-speed is slower.  

 

 

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Ok, so what you are really saying is that Macs are better? ....or nah?  Because it kinda seems like that is what you are saying or perhaps, hinting too in a way....

As we folks down yonder in the south would say to ya is..."you cant squeeze blood out of a turnip!"

Glad I could be of good assistance for ya'll today, be sure to catch my new video revealing how I integrated a Cummins diesal engine into an ACER Pentium Quad Core desktop I bought at Sam's Club.  Make no mistake harnessing the power of a Cummins diesel to get you through your next studio project!!
 

Edited by Clovis Ramsay
I do not know what I do

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6 hours ago, Clovis Ramsay said:

 Make no mistake harnessing the power of a Cummins diesel to get you through your next studio project!!

I wouldn't touch a Cummins, Duramax is better

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On 2/9/2021 at 12:13 AM, Clovis Ramsay said:

Ok, so what you are really saying is that Macs are better? ....or nah?  Because it kinda seems like that is what you are saying or perhaps, hinting too in a way....

As we folks down yonder in the south would say to ya is..."you cant squeeze blood out of a turnip!"

That's not what I'm saying in any way/shape/form.  😉

We deal with many Mac users who simply can't get the speed/configuration they need to run large scoring templates.

The solution is a well-configured custom PC DAW.  Exactly what they need... nothing more... nothing less

Windows 10 is a fine DAW platform... once fully reined-in.

 

If you watch any popular TV series, you're hearing scoring work that's using a PC.

Danny Lux, Timothy Wynn, Fred Coury, etc...

The top LA based composers meet once a month for dinner... to discuss all things technology and music.

Edited by Jim Roseberry
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