norfolkmastering Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 I just installed VB-Audio 'Matrix' which is quite a neat audio router app. I had hoped to use it with CbB for a routing solution which I can't do in Cakewalk alone. Unfortunately CbB won't load with the Matrix app installed. Has anyone got experience of the Matrix app or any other VB-Audio apps? And has anyone got it to run with CbB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 What does "won't load" mean? Is there an error? Possibly VB-Audio overwrote the MS VC++ Redistributable with something that's incompatible with CbB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWillyDS12 Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 VB Audio Matrix registers 4 different Virtual ASIO drivers in the registry... Open up regedit and go to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\ASIO and delete all of the VB-Matrix entries but VB-Matrix VASIO-128... Cakewalk will now load and the VB-Matrix VASIO-128 can be selected as your ASIO driver... You have to do your routing out of Cakewalk to the VB-Matrix and then in the VB-Matrix App route to your Hardware output ASIO... It seems to be working ok... I only routed two tracks... I just downloaded the VB Audio Matrix after reading your post... Took a while to figure out what Cakewalk didn't like with it... I tried it with MixCraft and it worked as installed... I've been using DS WASAPI ASIO Router Mixer to use multiple ASIO devices but the VB Audio Matrix may be a better option... With DS WASAPI ASIO Router Mixer you can "loopback" to a hardware device, it does not present itself as a Virtual ASIO to other apps... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkmastering Posted April 19 Author Share Posted April 19 Thanks for the advice. I'll try removing the VB-Matrix entries as suggested and report back. To reply to the earlier question, I got the Cakewalk by Bandlab splash screen, then that disappeared, then nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 One of the issues with aggregate ASIO drivers (such as VB-Matrix, ASIO4ALL, and Steinberg's/FLStudio/Reaper's generic ASIO drivers), is that it has to open the underlying audio device it's wrapping - that could be either the native WDM or ASIO device. Depending on what device you have, if something else then tries to open the native WDM or ASIO driver, it can cause issues - including a crash. In ASIO4ALL's case, it opens the device and never closes it (ASIO4ALL just sits in the system tray), essentially blocking or fighting with the real ASIO driver. This is the main reason Cakewalk doesn't support it by default. ASIOLink plays nicely and doesn't have these issues from what I could tell. Pity it's such a pain to set up though. I must have a look at VB-Matrix... sounds like a useful way of linking apps together using ASIO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkmastering Posted April 19 Author Share Posted April 19 After removing the three VB-Matrix drivers from the registry, I got CbB to open with VB-Matrix'. I actually left all the VB-Matrix VASIO drivers unchecked in Cakewalk. This allows me route to/from the Audiomovers VST plugin 'INJECT' to/from the VB-Matrix Virtual Inputs and Outputs. Why? I have been trying to get pre-FX send and returns in Cakewalk tracks for years but never found a way. I need these for a rather obscure purpose in my hybrid studio setup. So to generate a track preFX output, I insert an instance of VST INJECT to that track, route that to a VASIO (virtual audio ASIO) and then (using the 'Matrix' router) I can route that virtual output onwards to a real MOTU ASIO output. The setup seems quite happy for Cakewalk and VB-Matrix' to route to and from my MOTU audio interfaces which is surprising but great. The only problem I have is that Cakewalk sometimes won't allow a Save Project if there are instances of INJECT in the project. I get a sharing violation message. I'm talking to the folks at Audiomovers about this but if anyone has a fix, please let me know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 13 minutes ago, norfolkmastering said: The only problem I have is that Cakewalk sometimes won't allow a Save Project if there are instances of INJECT in the project. I get a sharing violation message. I'm talking to the folks at Audiomovers about this but if anyone has a fix, please let me know. Total shot in the dark here... but does disabling the audio engine before saving solve it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkmastering Posted April 19 Author Share Posted April 19 Tried disabling the audio engine before saving but still got the same violation message. For some reason using Save As to a new file name is allowed (but not practical except for testing). Any other suggestions welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWillyDS12 Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 On 4/19/2024 at 6:56 AM, msmcleod said: One of the issues with aggregate ASIO drivers (such as VB-Matrix, ASIO4ALL, and Steinberg's/FLStudio/Reaper's generic ASIO drivers), is that it has to open the underlying audio device it's wrapping - that could be either the native WDM or ASIO device. Depending on what device you have, if something else then tries to open the native WDM or ASIO driver, it can cause issues - including a crash. In ASIO4ALL's case, it opens the device and never closes it (ASIO4ALL just sits in the system tray), essentially blocking or fighting with the real ASIO driver. This is the main reason Cakewalk doesn't support it by default. ASIOLink plays nicely and doesn't have these issues from what I could tell. Pity it's such a pain to set up though. I must have a look at VB-Matrix... sounds like a useful way of linking apps together using ASIO. So I did a little more investigating\troubleshooting of CbB not opening with VB Audio Matrix... The issue is not VB Audio Matrix at all... The problem is a limitation\bug in the CbB UI, the exact same limitation\bug is present in the new Sonar... As soon as you exceed 276 available ASIO devices in any configuration, CbB or Sonar will not open... I used the VB Audio Matrix 256A ASIO driver from Coconut and My MOTU 828es to find the exact number... With 276 available devices, 256 from VB Matrix and 20 from my MOTU 828es both CbB and Sonar will open up just fine... Increase the count to 277, 256 from VB Matrix and 21 from the 828es and neither CbB or Sonar will open... Exact same two ASIO drivers, one hardware the other virtual... It did not matter what ASIO drivers I used, as soon as the available count exceeded 276 neither CbB or Sonar would open... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkmastering Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 Does the 276 ASIO devices mean 276 ASIO inputs PLUS 276 ASIO outputs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWillyDS12 Posted April 25 Share Posted April 25 I would assume so... I did not do a "full" count on outputs, just inputs before Cakewalk would not load... But when I had the VB Audio Matrix 256 VASIO enabled I had 268 output channels... 256 from the matrix and I have 12 outputs enable on My MOTU 828es... One master channel and 5 stereo sends for external effects... On 4/19/2024 at 10:47 AM, norfolkmastering said: I have been trying to get pre-FX send and returns in Cakewalk tracks for years but never found a way. I need these for a rather obscure purpose in my hybrid studio setup. So a question here... Can you use a two channel approach for the "pre-FX Send and Return"? A "Clean" channel with your audio on it output straight to your Audio interface and your FX and then input back to a second track... This would create an "Insert FX" say for an external compressor or such with the output fed back to your second track... The same type deal can be used for a send by coping your track to a second track and using the un-effected track as the send and not sent to your mix bus and the effected track sent to your mix bus and you add an FX return... You would probably end up with more track than you really want... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkmastering Posted Friday at 09:01 AM Author Share Posted Friday at 09:01 AM To answer your question: If I was just creating the odd "pre-FX send and Return" then the two channel approach would be okay, but I want to create 24 pre-FX sends and then 24 separately switchable, pre-FX returns. I need the pre-FX sends to be active, even when the returns are not switched in. This cannot be done using Cakewalk's own external inserts; but the combination of the INJECT VST plug-in and the VB-Matrix does the job really well. It also means that the Cakewalk track meters are an accurate indication of the audio level being returned into Cakewalk. So I have a great solution except for the save issue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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