Øyvind Skald Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Here is a sample of Lute-Harpsichord Bach: Goldberg Variations, BWV 988 (Lautenwerk/lute-harpsichord: Wolfgang Rübsam) Comment of this recording: "Here in this new Naxos Recording it is all about musical communication in a cantabile manner as desired by Bach in the preface of the Inventions. Much of this desire was stimulated via the baroque Italian Art of Song which incorporated the so called Portamento and Vacillare technique. The latter contributes to the reason why this recording sounds like none other to date. This art of polyphonic communication is accomplished by a horizontal, independent interaction of voices that creates the “unpredictability of the next measures”, even when listening to this recording many times. The interplay is simply too complex to memorize. Not even I know what will be communicated exactly next after some time “away” from the recording. Should some listeners not appreciate this art-form, it is likely because of what I call the “Glen Gould Virus” that globally has preprogrammed the inner ear of Bach keyboard audiences; pre-programmed it to know what the next measure is to sound like, including the metronomic “beating of the music”. When this does not happen, the listener becomes likely upset. This is then under the headline of ONLY “hearing music”, namely just the printed score black on white. The horizontal approach in my recordings by contrast requires a “listening to music”, best achieved by observing the larger pulse of the scores, not individual beats. I recently also recorded on the lautenwerk Bach’s complete Well Tempered Clavier book 1+2 in 5 albums on my label Counterpoint Records. These and other recordings can be downloaded in CD quality FLAC from my website: www.wolfgangrubsam.com Enjoy this new/old way of performance practice and at least “ try to fight “ the Gould Virus. Then you will be able to follow each voice of the polyphony in ways never experienced before. I recommend to listen over good headphones to experience the wide stereo from bass to treble." But i dont know of that recording is by a real one. Here is a recording with the real deal: They say J. S. Bach was involved with the development and design of it and had some in his possession when he died. Most of recordings today are just Harpsichords with nylon/gut strings instead of seal strings as supposed on a Harpsichord. But this is a totally different construction. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lautenwerck. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Beautiful looking instrument. I'm not sure if it would be loud enough to play in anything but a small gathering though with the strings laying on top like that instead of inside a sound chamber where it would be amplified much more. Have you heard one up close? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstrEd Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 It is a cool looking instrument. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 5 hours ago, Will said: Beautiful looking instrument. I'm not sure if it would be loud enough to play in anything but a small gathering though with the strings laying on top like that instead of inside a sound chamber where it would be amplified much more. Have you heard one up close? No. I would love to. And I guess your right. It wont make enough sound maybe more than a normal lute, but not much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, InstrEd said: It is a cool looking instrument. Yeah. Yould love to just se one IRL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) Absolutely, it certainly is a wonderful sound, but recently I fell in love with the clavichord, especially as played by Wim Winters. See here: You can also still buy kits for a clavichord, or buy them built. Bach apparently had several of these in his home, for his students to practise on. Edited January 17, 2019 by JohnG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstrEd Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 The sustain pedal really fills the room with sound if you know what I mean. I still like to listen to these older pieces of music to. Wim Winters is doing a wonderful job playing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 On 1/17/2019 at 7:35 PM, JohnG said: Absolutely, it certainly is a wonderful sound, but recently I fell in love with the clavichord, especially as played by Wim Winters. See here: You can also still buy kits for a clavichord, or buy them built. Bach apparently had several of these in his home, for his students to practise on. I fallow him. His videos about time measure and how to implement it to music is very interesting. But we can never know how fast J. S. Bach, G. F. Händel and the rest really played. I hope he gets his Studio done soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 14 hours ago, ØSkald said: I fallow him. His videos about time measure and how to implement it to music is very interesting. But we can never know how fast J. S. Bach, G. F. Händel and the rest really played. I hope he gets his Studio done soon. Yes, his ideas about time measure, etc. are extremely controversial. I'm not sure that I agree with him, but then I'm a novice concerning historically accurate performance tempo. But he plays extremely well. I like the the sound of his clavichord, and how the treble, tenor and bass each seem to have their own character. Bach mostly didn't mark tempi on his works. Certainly the cantatas show little evidence. His original scores can be found at bach-digital dot com. I've been working slowly through the cantatas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted January 22, 2019 Author Share Posted January 22, 2019 1 hour ago, JohnG said: Yes, his ideas about time measure, etc. are extremely controversial. I'm not sure that I agree with him, but then I'm a novice concerning historically accurate performance tempo. But he plays extremely well. I like the the sound of his clavichord, and how the treble, tenor and bass each seem to have their own character. Bach mostly didn't mark tempi on his works. Certainly the cantatas show little evidence. His original scores can be found at bach-digital dot com. I've been working slowly through the cantatas. Wow. Thank you… I will make bach-digital dot com a part of my go to libraries. The other guys are putting words in Winters moth. I don’t think I have ever heard him say that you are to count double on Andante and slower. Just for maybe Allegretto, but the faster ones. But we will never know, because none of the composer back then wrote bpm and how to count it. But I guess the controversy is most about early 19th century works where there is a bpm and there is written evidence of what Winter is saying, and you have the school of thought that we all know. One thing for sure is that it is technically impossible to play faster than a given speed on piano forte because of the hammer mechanic didn’t have the stopper/damper of the hammer, as the modern piano has. But anyways. I love reading about such things. I guess you are too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starise Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 I also love that instrument. Interesting how it might have come about, " let's take a harp of two and lay them sideways. We could add keys to it with hammers that hit the strings." I like classical music, but I think it needs to be brought more into the 20th century. Lots of musicians are only taught the music of the "masters". I think there has been and continues to be great compositions that are only heard in small circles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted January 24, 2019 Author Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Here is the Bach i listen to now. It is Lute-Harpsichord the wrong way tho. But "better" than conventional Harpsichords? I at least think this is easier listenable. There is more definition of the tones. Harpsichord works great in orchestra. And I love it too. But I know many of my friends cant handle it. So, I can see why Bach and others wanted more lute like tone in their keyboards. And the real L-H is the best in that regard. As for the clavichord, that is also beautiful. But there is a "problem " with it that people nowadays struggle with it. Your velocity doesn’t only set how loud it is, it also sets the pitch. You also have an aftertouch on the pitch that can make one of the strings in a chord vibrate, if you want. But most of the time, chords get out of tune because of you press down one finger harder. But nonetheless, I love it. It has tons of soul. I bet you guys knew that about clavichord. I just pointed it out, if there are any here not knowing. Edited January 24, 2019 by ØSkald Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 (edited) Skald, If you're interested in Bach, and it certainly seems that you are, like me, then another site you might enjoyvery much is allofbach.com. I enjoy their music so much that I've even decided to make a monthly (small) subscription to them to help them continue their work. Edited February 12, 2019 by JohnG youtube link 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Øyvind Skald Posted February 12, 2019 Author Share Posted February 12, 2019 5 hours ago, JohnG said: Skald, If you're interested in Bach, and it certainly seems that you are, like me, then another site you might enjoyvery much is allofbach.com. I enjoy their music so much that I've even decided to make a monthly (small) subscription to them to help them continue their work. https://youtu.be/PdNjyzxqmWU Thanks. Checking it out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstrEd Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Wow they are so intense. I guess back in the day if you made a wrong note - 🎹 Off with your head😮 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 It's a very modern recording, done I believe, just a matter of days ago. They're just as intense today! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grem Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Good thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstrEd Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 They did a wonderful job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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