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Reid Rosefelt

Steinberg discontinues VST2

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1 hour ago, shawker said:

u-he is working on this as an alternative to VST/VST3,

CLAP is an open source plug-in format originally designed by Alexandre Bique a few years ago that we currently help to bring forward, along with friends at Bitwig and a whole bunch of other developers from both host and plug-in side.

https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=574861

Okay, but please do not refer to this plug-in format as "the clap" as in: "did you get the clap yet?"  Just saying...

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CLAP sounds interesting. Maybe it will eventually branch out into more plugins. DAWs will also need to be set up for it.

I have developed more of a passive approach. If I can update it inexpensively  I do. If I can't I let it go. Pretty simple for me. I wonder if those using PT and Logic have any similar issue since all of their plugins are in a different format?

I did notice quite a difference in how many plugins scan  Cubase compared to Cakewalk and wondered why. As it turns out all of the plugins I needed for the mix were there so I never gave it a second thought at the time. I suspect that's the way I'll keep rolling. If my best bread and butter plugs are there, my " I give a durned"switch is off  :)

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1 hour ago, Zo said:

This might xplain why vertigo vsc 3 isnt vst 2 while vse 2 is ... is it on a per plugins basis or brand and all its release ?

It's a company/unit license so if they had one for version 2 of their plugin, they should be covered for version 3, etc.  I would also think a company could hire/subcontract a company with a license to subcontract the publishing, maybe.  But that kind of legal jumping is way over my pay grade.  Not clear if you can pass the license on (if a company is bought/etc).  Would have to read the fine print.

The license was free though (which is how free plugins can be made) but since it is not open source you can't really do "true" open source VST plugins or even mix GPL code with VST code.   I'm sure I've seen a few open source apps that didn't support VST because of the license mess.  And there is a lot of gray area stuff, that may or may not live up to the license.  You end up with things like "This is open source, except for this small part of it, which is licensed differently."  No clue if that kind of thing is really legal.  You see this kind of legal gymnastics in Wordpress plugins too.

And of course they no longer make the SDK and development files available anymore and there is no support.  Which just makes things harder.  They really are trying pretty hard to kill VST2.

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the recent aquisitions by "investment" companies and the propensity for legal extortion is another shadow on the wall.  

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1 hour ago, Matthew Sorrels said:

The license was free though (which is how free plugins can be made) but since it is not open source you can't really do "true" open source VST plugins or even mix GPL code with VST code.  

Well, there's this:

Quote

This Software Development Kit is licensed under the terms of the Steinberg VST3 License,
or alternatively under the terms of the General Public License (GPL) Version 3.
You may use the Software Development Kit according to either of these licenses as it is
most appropriate for your project on a case-by-case basis (commercial or not).

There are proprietary and open source VST3 licensing options. Even the VST3 SDK is open under GPLv3.

https://developer.steinberg.help/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=9797944


I must confess that I for one don't understand the VST licensing. What are you actually being licensed to do? Creating modules that use the API? Using the SDK? Using the VST logo (mandatory)? If I create a module that uses the API without using the SDK (never having agreed to its terms), leaving out the logo which I'm not licensed to use, am I infringing their IP rights, and if so, how would their attorney explain it in court?

Edited by sarine

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30 minutes ago, sarine said:

Well, there's this:

There are proprietary and open source VST3 licensing options. Even the VST3 SDK is open under GPLv3.

https://developer.steinberg.help/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=9797944


I must confess that I for one don't understand the VST licensing. What are you actually being licensed to do? Creating modules that use the API? Using the SDK? Using the VST logo (mandatory)? If I create a module that uses the API without using the SDK (never having agreed to its terms), leaving out the logo which I'm not licensed to use, am I infringing their IP rights, and if so, how would their attorney explain it in court?

You are quoting the VST3 licensing options here. I believe Matt was referring to the now deprecated VST2 licensing terms.

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4 hours ago, locrian said:

Okay, but please do not refer to this plug-in format as "the clap" as in: "did you get the clap yet?"  Just saying...

Ahhh, you took all the fun out of it. Party pooper.

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1 hour ago, sarine said:

Even the VST3 SDK is open under GPLv3

GPL3 is very copyleft. If you choose to license as GPL, your derived product must also be licensed as GPL. You can still sell it (I think...), but you have to make the source 'available'.

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3 hours ago, satyabrata satapathy said:

IS THIS ALSO THE END OF 32 BIT PLUGINS

Yes/maybe/no.........You need to be more specific !

Did you read the original announcement ?

Are you planning to use - cubase ?  - nuendo ? - wavelab ? in the future ?

Do you have any VST2 only plugins ?

(WHY ARE YOU TYPING IN CAPITALS?)

 

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10 hours ago, satyabrata satapathy said:

IS THIS ALSO THE END OF 32 BIT PLUGINS

MOST DAWS HAVE MOVED ON TO 64-BIT OS VERSIONS AND 64-BIT PLUGINS, AND REQUIRE THE USE OF BRIDGING TECHNOLOGY TO SUPPORT 32-BIT PLUGINS.

SO 32-BIT PLUGINS HAVE EFFECTIVELY ALREADY BEEN ENDED. BUT OLD PLUGINS WILL NOT SUDDENLY STOP WORKING IF YOU STILL HAVE THE MEANS TO HOST THEM.

 

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1 hour ago, abacab said:

MOST DAWS HAVE MOVED ON TO 64-BIT OS VERSIONS AND 64-BIT PLUGINS, AND REQUIRE THE USE OF BRIDGING TECHNOLOGY TO SUPPORT 32-BIT PLUGINS.

SO 32-BIT PLUGINS HAVE EFFECTIVELY ALREADY BEEN ENDED. BUT OLD PLUGINS WILL NOT SUDDENLY STOP WORKING IF YOU STILL HAVE THE MEANS TO HOST THEM.

One of my old bosses used to type in all caps. From the day he hired me I thought he was mad at me. It made a horrible working environment. Finally one day I asked him what I did wrong to make him so mad. He had no idea what I was talking about. I pointed out how he was always typing in caps when he would send me a message or email. He laughed and said he had no idea that typing in caps meant you were yelling at someone and that he had to have caps lock on for the antiquated DOS based dispatching software the owner forced them to use and he just left it on by force of habit when sending emails or messaging us through the dispatch system.

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IMMA NOT MAD AT YOU SHANE. I JUST WHISPER IN ALL CAPS.

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14 hours ago, Shane_B. said:

One of my old bosses used to type in all caps. From the day he hired me I thought he was mad at me. It made a horrible working environment. Finally one day I asked him what I did wrong to make him so mad. He had no idea what I was talking about. I pointed out how he was always typing in caps when he would send me a message or email. He laughed and said he had no idea that typing in caps meant you were yelling at someone and that he had to have caps lock on for the antiquated DOS based dispatching software the owner forced them to use and he just left it on by force of habit when sending emails or messaging us through the dispatch system.

I SHOULD CHANGE MY NAME TO CAP MAN😅. I M JUST TOO LAZY TO CHANGE FROM SMALL TO CAPS N EITHER. I M TOO THE BOSS OF MY CONSULTANCY FIRM LOL

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On 1/20/2022 at 6:37 PM, shawker said:

u-he is working on this as an alternative to VST/VST3,

CLAP is an open source plug-in format originally designed by Alexandre Bique a few years ago that we currently help to bring forward, along with friends at Bitwig and a whole bunch of other developers from both host and plug-in side.

https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=574861

Am I the only one here thinking the inevitable joke?

 

 

 

Does anyone on this forum have CLAP?

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1 hour ago, Philip G Hunt said:

Am I the only one here thinking the inevitable joke?

 

 

 

Does anyone on this forum have CLAP?

Nope.

 

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On 1/21/2022 at 4:56 PM, Shane_B. said:

He laughed and said he had no idea that typing in caps meant you were yelling at someone

It is pretty ridiculous. I think it was early 90's when I first heard of the concept that big letters = shouting - someone I know had actually gotten disciplinary warning from work management for "shouting" at an American colleague in an email and in truth the idea doesn't sound any less daft to me today than it did then. 

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22 hours ago, Philip G Hunt said:

Does anyone on this forum have CLAP?

No, but I've had the Audacity to check out the LADSPA. 😄

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On 1/22/2022 at 2:26 AM, satyabrata satapathy said:

😅I M JUST TOO LAZY TO CHANGE FROM SMALL TO CAPS N EITHER. 

Is that an excuse? 

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