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Morten Saether

[CLOSED] Cakewalk 2021.04 Update 1 Release Candidate [Updated to build 170]

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28 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

>>5 - Unhandled errors and heap corruption is detected  (Default)

@Colin Nicholls What is your exception handling level set to? In 155 it defaults to 5 if you haven’t set it. You can try setting it back to 7 to catch even  more unhandled exceptions.
 

 

I've set it to 7, and I'll see how things go tomorrow. Thanks.

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3 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

I don’t follow. It is already optional if you uncheck the box…

Yes, it's an optional OPT-OUT, but is it by any chance set to OPT-IN on the last release BY DEFAULT?

My argument is that it should be optional rather than a forced transition to VST3. 

Not everyone who updates from previous builds may realize what is happening, and, as not everyone is an IT wizard, they might lose days or weeks of work trying to troubleshoot a problem with drop-outs, stuttering audio, or unexpected closure of the software, when all they really want from the software is an out-the-box environment in which they can make music.

I can see from other Cakewalk users that I am not the only one to have experienced this issue, and it has caused projects to grind to a halt as a result. Yes, it can be argued that it is the fault of the VST vendor. Yes, it can be argued that VST3 is the new standard. All this can be argued, but until CbB works nicely with these VST3s (causing an interruption of service which in turn creates bad publicity for Cakewalk by Bandlab) the simplest solution would be to make those boxes OPT-IN, rather than OPT-OUT in each new build. This would have no negative impact on those who already have VST3s happily loaded in their projects, and it will have no negative impact on those who are happily using VST2 instruments.  But by FORCING the VST3 to replace VST2, it most definitely IS causing problems.

I hope this clarifies what I mean.

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7 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

@Milton Sica Are you sure about this? There is no cost unless of course an error occurs. Have you tried it with a setting of 5 instead of 1?
5 will at least detect heap corruption. Please check and let me know if you can actually demonstrate a slowdown by timing it or posting a video.
I’ve not noticed any slowdowns with many plugins.
 

I rode several times with set 1 and set 5 suggested and the best performance on my machine was 1.

 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Philip G Hunt said:

Yes, it's an optional OPT-OUT, but is it by any chance set to OPT-IN on the last release BY DEFAULT?

My argument is that it should be optional rather than a forced transition to VST3. 

Not everyone who updates from previous builds may realize what is happening, and, as not everyone is an IT wizard, they might lose days or weeks of work trying to troubleshoot a problem with drop-outs, stuttering audio, or unexpected closure of the software, when all they really want from the software is an out-the-box environment in which they can make music.

I can see from other Cakewalk users that I am not the only one to have experienced this issue, and it has caused projects to grind to a halt as a result. Yes, it can be argued that it is the fault of the VST vendor. Yes, it can be argued that VST3 is the new standard. All this can be argued, but until CbB works nicely with these VST3s (causing an interruption of service which in turn creates bad publicity for Cakewalk by Bandlab) the simplest solution would be to make those boxes OPT-IN, rather than OPT-OUT in each new build. This would have no negative impact on those who already have VST3s happily loaded in their projects, and it will have no negative impact on those who are happily using VST2 instruments.  But by FORCING the VST3 to replace VST2, it most definitely IS causing problems.

I hope this clarifies what I mean.

As I clarified in my PM there is no one size fits all solution. There are known cases with major vendors where running vst2 and vst3 versions side by side cause crashes. So the default is set to favor VST3  migration. Note that migration ONLY occurs if it is explicitly supported by the vendor so it the vendor doesn't want this to happen they should not allow it.

This is not a new behaviour and has been in place since 2013

Edited by Noel Borthwick

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17 minutes ago, Milton Sica said:

I rode several times with set 1 and set 5 suggested and the best performance on my machine was 1.

 

@Milton Sica With which  plugins specifically? If you can provide a test project for us to verify it will be useful.

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41 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Thanks do you see overhead only when loading the project or when playing it?

Only in charge.

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7 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Sorry I don't follow. When do you see the difference - loading or playing?

Loading !

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Thanks for the next build I've changed it to default to 1 so it will be opt-in for now. 
I really don't see why this would make any difference unless some plugins are throwing thousands of exceptions.

Its a bit of a shame since in general we want errors to be flagged otherwise they will never get fixed. I recommend running with level 7 for troubleshooting since that is the most strict. We are already finding many previously undetected plugin issues.

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Just installed it. Offset is working correctly. Current projects are working but they are relatively light FX wise. I will try a heavier project later tonight.

Thanks

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Installed here.

 

Right off the bat, I'm not seeing either the constant crashes I was with the last update build, but it's handling things better than it was before as well. I guess that's because the new default is 1 instead of 5 as it was even previous to the update?

 

Thanks... I'll switch to 5 and see how it performs, try 7 as well...

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What about the (old) tempo editor? I've installed the latest version of Cakewalk. I can use just the (new) tempo track, but I can't find the (old) tempo editor. Is this normal?

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4 minutes ago, Vangelis Karafillidis said:

What about the (old) tempo editor? I've installed the latest version of Cakewalk. I can use just the (new) tempo track, but I can't find the (old) tempo editor. Is this normal?

Unfortunately!

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12 hours ago, Keni said:

Installed here.

 

Right off the bat, I'm not seeing either the constant crashes I was with the last update build, but it's handling things better than it was before as well. I guess that's because the new default is 1 instead of 5 as it was even previous to the update?

 

Thanks... I'll switch to 5 and see how it performs, try 7 as well...

We you running with 5 earlier or 7? If so your crashes were real, we’re just the messenger reporting them. If you don’t want messages and prefer to potentially crash silently and randomly set it to 1 :)

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37 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

We you running with 5 earlier or 7? If so your crashes were real, we’re just the messenger reporting them. If you don’t want messages and prefer to potentially crash silently and randomly set it to 1 :)

Thanks Noel!

 

I think I understand. Honestly I’m not sure where I was set. I never changed it so I believe they were the defaults.

I'm happy to suffer occasional crashes of this sort being harmful to no data and only a morsel of my time so as to help us all. This last one was overwhelming though. Crashed every time with a template-project I use regularly for my mastering. Previously, It crashed on me occasionally anyway, and I chalked that up to one or more of the plugins in this project though typically all but 2-3 are ever active.

 

So each of my experiences was with defaults of the release. I don’t need the reports myself but I was under the belief that leaving it on somehow helps you and the team develop Cake!

My crashes do mostly go away at 1

 

Thanks again!

 

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Some notes in version 170:

1) After closing the project and getting ready to make the page of other projects available to open the application, it is like "Not responding". I need to end the Cakewalk task via the Task Manager. My procedures before closing the project: Save, Export the Mix.

2) There is still a slow loading of projects that contain vst Ozone 9 Elements. I have Ozone included in 6 Stereo BUS with 6 Presets in each one. Sometimes, opening a project takes 1 to almost 2 minutes.

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