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Konskoo

I want to build a computer for Cakewalk

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1 hour ago, Steev said:

It's available for free to all registered users of Focusrite audio interfaces and Novation MIDI keyboard controllers with a choice of 1 free sample pack included

Addictive Keys download.

Great plan if you need either of these hardware devices. Get a piano for free!

Edited by abacab
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1 hour ago, abacab said:

Get a piano for free!

Do you have to pay for Piano Movers.......ūüėú

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No paying for piano movers & it never needs tuning, unless of course you want to change "Temperaments" then of course you are free to do so.

 I've been using  Focusrite Scarlett 18i20's for years now, from gen 1 and currently using gen 2 as my main USB audio interface and they have been pretty much bullet proof. So has my Novation Impulse 61 MIDI keyboard controller.

 And believe me, their are quite a few very high quality audio FX plugins offered in Focusrite's "Plugin Collective" for free that I would not like to live without.

 So many you could actually save money by purchasing a Scarlett 2x2 USB audio interface and throwing it in the garbage just to keep the bundled plugins and software.

ūü§£¬†

It's probably the 2nd BEST VALUE on the planet.

Second only to CbB of course, which has not only been my absolute hands down "GO TO" favorite DAW for a couple of decades now, everything you hear in this piece, with the exception of XLN Audio's Addictive Drums 2 and Keys using "Modern Upright" piano samples is included in CbB. 

 I had gotten Addictive Drums 1 and 2 free years ago with a SONAR Update. I got Addictive Keys "Studio Grand" free upgrading my Focusrite Scarlett from 1st gen to gen 2, and got AK's "Modern Upright" sample pack with my Novation Impulse 61.

 As much as I'd recommend the Novation Impulse 61 as a great feeling and playing all around excellent MIDI keyboard, DAW, and plugin controller, it only has 61 semi weighted keys which almost but doesn't really suit many concert pianists insistence on weighted keys typically found on acoustic pianos, not to mention only 61 keys which is over 2 octaves short, and only has access to one foot pedal.

This is a raw unfinished, unmastered mix uploaded into Bandlab's "Mix Editor" in multi tracks. Feel free to analyze each track, remix, delete, replace or what ever to any track(s), and make it your own.

 The piano track was recorded using AK's "Modern Upright"

https://www.bandlab.com/band/band6873043074588134/a-salty-dog-31725dca-ac6a28a7

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OK I forgot about that. That must be why I have all the XLN pianos. I have the Mark II etc. It was that deal via Focusrite. And yes the RED VST collection is one I use a lot after I say a guy using them exclusively on a digital console system. I had just wrote them off as yet more eq's and compressors to learn about but they just plain work they way I want them to work so I now use them as my "go to". 

I mention this fact in my how to shop for an interface blurb. Never rule out the freebies that come with some interfaces. There's a lot of added value sometimes. 

To the OP- my name is said just like you say Beer or Deer! When I tell people my name they always say " Oh like the Tracktor!" 

 Thanks for taking the time to listen to my music. It's just my hobbie and I don't really do much with it once created. I enjoy the process of creating something that I like. Sorry I don't really have any pianos featured, they are just part of the background of most of my music. I use a lot of Wurly's on my backing tracks. The this one is the MArk II https://www.soundclick.com/music/songInfo.cfm?songID=13626058 

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4 hours ago, John Vere said:

Thanks for taking the time to listen to my music. It's just my hobbie and I don't really do much with it once created. I enjoy the process of creating something that I like. Sorry I don't really have any pianos featured, they are just part of the background of most of my music. I use a lot of Wurly's on my backing tracks. The this one is the MArk II https://www.soundclick.com/music/songInfo.cfm?songID=13626058 

Nice tune John! Clever lyrics! I couldn't resist checking out the rest of the playlist. ūüėĄ

I am a fan of  acoustic folk and Americana style music (and all good music in general).

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Steev, thank you. I took into attention.

Steev, you make nice music. I listened with pleasure.

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John, thank you. Understood.

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Question to everybody.

I have read about audio interfaces. I will connect audio interface to computer. Specifically I will connect audio interface to motherboard of computer. I think about port. Do I need to use USB port? Or do I need to use Thunderbolt port? Or do I need to use FireWire port? Or do I need to use some other port?

I need to have corresponding port on computer, specifically on motherboard. Or I need to have corresponding port on expansion card, and expansion card will be connected to motherboard inside computer.

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10 hours ago, Konskoo said:

Question to everybody.

I have read about audio interfaces. I will connect audio interface to computer. Specifically I will connect audio interface to motherboard of computer. I think about port. Do I need to use USB port? Or do I need to use Thunderbolt port? Or do I need to use FireWire port? Or do I need to use some other port?

I need to have corresponding port on computer, specifically on motherboard. Or I need to have corresponding port on expansion card, and expansion card will be connected to motherboard inside computer.

The audio interface will connect to a port on the motherboard. USB 2.0 is the most common one used today and ready to go on almost all modern PCs. USB 2.0 has more than enough bandwidth for pro audio. There is really no need to pay for more than a good USB 2.0 interface. Bottom line answer for new users is to go with this.

I would check out the FocusRite Scarlett 3rd gen units for starters. They range from single audio inputs, to 18 inputs. For new users I would shoot for 1 or 2 inputs, but since you will only be using virtual instruments, you really won't have much need for extra audio inputs, unless you would decide to record from external inputs  someday.

The FocusRite brand has a good reputation, and is shown here as an example only, not a specific recommendation. https://focusrite.com/en/scarlett

Less common are USB 3.0 based interfaces, and Thunderbolt. Most of today's PC's have USB 3.0 on-board, and that would also be fine and ready to go. But setting up Thunderbolt on a PC requires some expert knowledge and a PC must meet specific requirements to be set up with that. Unless you  already know why you would need Thunderbolt, I would not bother.

FireWire has become old tech, and I wouldn't bother to set that up on a new PC today. PC and motherboard manufacturers stopped building the FireWire ports on-board years ago. You have to install an add-on PCI Express card to use it.

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My suspicion is that it would be difficult to purchase a new Windows 10 Intel/AMD desktop or laptop that would not be more than sufficient to the task of recording a solo piano performance, be it mic'd acoustic, VSTi, or digital piano recorded direct. The only caveat would be that I prefer at least 12G of RAM, but even 8G would be fine.

My 8-year-old Dell tower can do it without any strain; heck, my 10-year-old Dell notebook can do it with no problem.

@Konskoo, one thing to know when reading our advice is that most of the people on this forum will assume that "build" means you wish to buy a separate case, power supply, motherboard, memory, disk drive(s), graphics card, keyboard, mouse, monitor and audio interface and either put it all together or have someone else put it all together. Is that what you mean?

There is an advantage to buying a pre-configured system (Dell, HP, or smaller system integrator), which is that all of the components are guaranteed to function together. The specifications given by us can be applied to shopping for a system that meets them with few additions necessary (audio interface, 2nd SSD, possibly more RAM). Otherwise, if it is your intention to assemble a system from all these different components that you select yourself, go for it.

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13 hours ago, Starship Krupa said:

@Konskoo, one thing to know when reading our advice is that most of the people on this forum will assume that "build" means you wish to buy a separate case, power supply, motherboard, memory, disk drive(s), graphics card, keyboard, mouse, monitor and audio interface and either put it all together or have someone else put it all together. Is that what you mean?

Already asked and answered.

On 9/24/2020 at 4:04 AM, Konskoo said:

abacab, yes, I want to build desktop.

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abacab, thank you. I took into attention.

On 10/14/2020 at 6:15 PM, abacab said:

The FocusRite brand has a good reputation, and is shown here as an example only, not a specific recommendation. https://focusrite.com/en/scarlett

Thank you, abacab. I will research link you gave.

On 10/14/2020 at 6:15 PM, abacab said:

The audio interface will connect to a port on the motherboard. USB 2.0 is the most common one used today and ready to go on almost all modern PCs. USB 2.0 has more than enough bandwidth for pro audio. There is really no need to pay for more than a good USB 2.0 interface. Bottom line answer for new users is to go with this.

abacab, if I will use audio interface with USB 2.0 will I have latency?

Edited by Konskoo

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6 hours ago, Konskoo said:

abacab, if I will use audio interface with USB 2.0 will I have latency?

That topic is worthy of a forum thread of it's own! But I will add the following distinction to audio latency as it applies to audio recording on a DAW in general, and with what you are trying to do with a virtual instrument alone. If any more questions on latency, suggest a new forum topic to attract quality responses. ūüėČ

You can have some audio latency with any audio interface.

If you try some  Google research on the topic you will likely encounter a lot of discussions regarding round-trip latency. But that  doesn't fully apply to the one-way audio path if using only virtual instruments (well maybe 50%).

Round-trip latency  involves recording an external source using a line or mic in, through the audio interface inputs (A/D conversion), processing it in the computer application (DAW + virtual instrument + any effects), then playing the DAW result back through the interface outputs (D/A conversion) to the monitors. The latency can be an annoyance when you can hear what you are playing live, and then also hear the processed signal from the PC again with a delay. The best way around this is to buy an interface with direct monitoring so you can enable that feature and monitor the input audio signal  at the interface before it goes into the computer.

But, the bottom line is that you will be recording a virtual instrument, so you will not be dealing with a round-trip. For example when you play a note on your MIDI keyboard the MIDI data goes directly to the instrument track and the tone generator plays the sound. Any latency at this point will most likely be controlled by your audio buffer setting. That is why the quality of the ASIO driver supplied by your interface manufacturer is important. You should be able to tweak the audio buffer size as low as possible so that   the latency is no longer detectable by ear from when you play a note until you hear the sound . For me that goal is usually <10ms.

 

Edited by abacab
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10 hours ago, abacab said:

That topic is worthy of a forum thread of it's own!

abacab, thank you. I took into attention.

10 hours ago, abacab said:

But I will add the following distinction to audio latency as it applies to audio recording on a DAW in general, and with what you are trying to do with a virtual instrument alone.

Thank you.

10 hours ago, abacab said:

If any more questions on latency, suggest a new forum topic to attract quality responses.

OK.

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I have read your answer. Thank you. I took into consideration.

10 hours ago, abacab said:

The best way around this is to buy an interface with direct monitoring so you can enable that feature and monitor the input audio signal  at the interface before it goes into the computer.

I want such interface. I want to learn about it. Also I want such interface would have switcher: direct monitoring on/off.

I have read: https://support.focusrite.com/hc/en-gb/articles/360000706625-How-to-use-the-Direct-Monitor-feature-on-the-Scarlett-Solo-2i2-and-iTrack-Solo

How to use the Direct Monitor feature on the Scarlett Solo, 2i2 and iTrack Solo.

This is the example of interface which have direct monitoring and switcher: direct monitoring on/off. Am I right?

10 hours ago, abacab said:

Any latency at this point will most likely be controlled by your audio buffer setting. That is why the quality of the ASIO driver supplied by your interface manufacturer is important. You should be able to tweak the audio buffer size as low as possible so that   the latency is no longer detectable by ear from when you play a note until you hear the sound . For me that goal is usually <10ms.

abacab, thank you. I took into consideration.

I have read that if interface has ASIO 2.0 I am able to set minimum buffer value to 64 or 128 bits. This is, respectively, 1.5 and 3 ms latency. Am I right? Does this part of discussion suitable to start new topic about latency? If yes I will start new topic about latency.

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abacab, which CPU to use for work in Cakewalk: Intel Core or AMD Ryzen?

Edited by Konskoo

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11 hours ago, Konskoo said:

I want such interface. I want to learn about it. Also I want such interface would have switcher: direct monitoring on/off.

I have read: https://support.focusrite.com/hc/en-gb/articles/360000706625-How-to-use-the-Direct-Monitor-feature-on-the-Scarlett-Solo-2i2-and-iTrack-Solo

How to use the Direct Monitor feature on the Scarlett Solo, 2i2 and iTrack Solo.

This is the example of interface which have direct monitoring and switcher: direct monitoring on/off. Am I right?

From the Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 user guide:

Quote

Using Direct Monitoring


You will frequently hear the term ‚Äúlatency‚ÄĚ used in connection with digital audio systems. In the case
of the simple DAW recording application described above, latency will be the time it takes for your
input signals to pass through your computer and audio software. Latency can be a problem for a
performer who wishes to record while monitoring their input signals.


The Scarlett 2i2 is fitted with a ‚ÄúDirect Monitoring‚ÄĚ option, which overcomes this problem. Setting the
front panel DIRECT MONITOR control to either MONO or STEREO will route your input signals
directly to the Scarlett 2i2’s headphone and main monitor outputs. This enables you to hear yourself
with zero latency ‚Äď i.e., in ‚Äúreal time‚ÄĚ ‚Äď along with the computer playback. The input signals to your
computer are not affected in any way by this setting.


 

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11 hours ago, Konskoo said:

I have read that if interface has ASIO 2.0 I am able to set minimum buffer value to 64 or 128 bits. This is, respectively, 1.5 and 3 ms latency. Am I right? Does this part of discussion suitable to start new topic about latency? If yes I will start new topic about latency.

Yes, with a new topic you should be able to collect various real-world experiences from other users about their actual latency performance and buffer settings using an audio interface.

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13 hours ago, Konskoo said:

abacab, which CPU to use for work in Cakewalk: Intel Core or AMD Ryzen?

I believe that the consensus around this community is that the real-time audio performance of the Intel Core is preferred. Ryzen offer a lot of performance for the buck, and is potentially better at gaming and video editing. That is just my opinion based on what I have read, although to be fair I have also heard some good reports from users with Ryzen based DAWs.

I chose the Intel Core i5-9600k 3.7GHz for my last build. It has 6-cores/threads, max turbo is 4.6Ghz. I have  all 6 cores locked to 4.6 GHz in my UEFI/BIOS (an option with 'K' series 'unlocked' Intel CPUs).

There is one more thing about the CPU and your DAW performance that has not been mentioned here yet. The single-thread clock speed of your chosen CPU is the most important factor for virtual instruments. Even if your DAW is multi-core aware, a virtual instrument is single threaded on one core. So you want the single CPU thread as fast as you can get it if you have a high CPU load due to high polyphony. Otherwise you may need to increase your audio buffer to prevent audio dropouts. Of course, with more cores you could theoretically run more plug-in instances of virtual instruments, subject to the limitations of your DAW program. Plug-in load balancing generally only applies to FX plug-ins, not instruments.

Edit: struck the comment about gaming...

Edited by abacab
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Intel is usually better at gaming and super-low latency audio. Ryzen is great for video-editing with all the cores for a decent price.  With the new Ryzen coming out in 3 weeks this could change as AMD worked on the latency and there is rumor that AMD added another Floating Point unit which could really help with Audio processing.  So if not in the most rush I would try to at least see the how the Ryzen performs. If Intel is still better for audio then go with Intel.

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31 minutes ago, InstrEd said:

Intel is usually better at gaming and super-low latency audio. Ryzen is great for video-editing with all the cores for a decent price.  With the new Ryzen coming out in 3 weeks this could change as AMD worked on the latency and there is rumor that AMD added another Floating Point unit which could really help with Audio processing.  So if not in the most rush I would try to at least see the how the Ryzen performs. If Intel is still better for audio then go with Intel.

I struck the earlier comment about gaming. First, in order to not derail this discussion into one about gaming. and second, because I have not kept up with the subject. My gaming rig is running a year 2012 model CPU, LOL! ūü§£

Edited by abacab

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If your main interest is piano, and you still need a keyboard controller, here is an inexpensive one with 88 keys (although not fully weighted) that comes with a free software bundle that includes Arturia Analog Lab (with 6500 sounds, sourced from Arturia's analog modeled V collection), which has a modeled virtual piano in grand and upright styles, as well as UVI's Model D (Steinway Concert Grand Model D captured in a brilliant European sound stage), that plays in UVI Workstation (free). https://www.uvi.net/model-d.html

https://www.arturia.com/products/hybrid-synths/keylab-essential-88/overview

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On 10/7/2020 at 10:27 AM, Brian Walton said:

I wouldn't get too caught up in which piano they sampled, it may or may not actually sound like what you have in your head as the S&S sound.

 

I'd download this for free as a starting point:

https://www.meldaproduction.com/MonasteryGrand

If it doesn't sound like you want after you tweak it with various mics and settings, then move on and try another.  

 

This was a revelation. I happen to have that along with quite a few others. Some expensive some not. None have been able to play a  particular piece as well as the melda one. I never used it before but your post motivated  me to try it.  It sounds very good but more important there is no machine sound to it or very little. It is a great piano!

Thank you for posting this. 

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