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recording vocals issue - SOLVED


greg54

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Sometimes when I record vocals, I get a little distortion.   Not only that, but I get weird frequencies, like way too much mids.   And I can't eq them out.     And there are times when i record vocals and they sound fine.

I built myself a vocal booth in my closet.  I draped thick blankets in there, and it has helped a lot.  But there are still times when I record vocals that are a little distorted and the eq is way off - too much mids and too dark sounding.  And they sound really flat.   No air at all. 

And no amount of eq or reverb can take away the harshness and flatness or give it air.   

I have tried other mics.  I've tried placing the mic at different angles and tried recording closer or further away.    I read where a guy said he had a similar issue and changed sampling rate (and something else) to get rid of the distortion.    

Anyway, any suggestions?   

Edited by greg54
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I'm suspicious of the sample rate solution. If you have distortion and it isn't digital clipping then it is the Mic or the preamp causing the distortion... Assuming you aren't using compressors or eqs before digitizing.

So if the distortion is mic or preamp driven, increasing sample rate cannot help resolve it.

Edited by Gswitz
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Make sure you use a pop filter to remove plosives, they could cause distortion. (I still use nylons over a bend wire coat hanger, because it just works.)

Other than that, creating a little vocal both can end up with a flat sounding take, but that is kind of the point. You should be able to improve a vocal take with emphasized mids using an EQ plugin - it might just take some finesse. Check out a few videos for ideas.

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A small vocal booth draped in blankets is going to sound very boxy. The purpose of the blankets is to make sure they are behind you when you sing into the mic. It's better to have nothing at all behind the mic itself, if by vocals, you mean singing. Singing can be loud and anything you put behind the mic while you sing will rebound back on to the mic with unpredictable but usually horrid results. Making sure that the reflection of sound from behind you when you sing into the mic is deadened is usually enough, it will deaden the sound of the room in general a little as well. If you need to deaden the sound of the room a bit more, cover one of the walls or set up a T stand with something draped over it, away from the mic. If you want air, you need to give the mic air.

Also, anything rebounding on to the mic can cause distortion because the mic diaphragm is being hit by conflicting sound waves from the front (your voice) and the back (whatever you have behind the mic that your voice is bouncing off of).

The pop screen can work as well for plosives but if your mic technique is good and you come at the mic from an angle and can back off/move away etc while you sing, you shouldn't need one. This can only be achieved if you have good isolated monitoring of your voice through headphones.

 

 

Edited by Tezza
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14 hours ago, Gswitz said:

I'm suspicious of the sample rate solution. If you have distortion and it isn't digital clipping then it is the Mic or the preamp causing the distortion... Assuming you aren't using compressors or eqs before digitizing.

So if the distortion is mic or preamp driven, increasing sample rate cannot help resolve it.

Yes, I changed the sample rate, and it did nothing.

13 hours ago, Colin Nicholls said:

Make sure you use a pop filter to remove plosives, they could cause distortion. (I still use nylons over a bend wire coat hanger, because it just works.)

Other than that, creating a little vocal both can end up with a flat sounding take, but that is kind of the point. You should be able to improve a vocal take with emphasized mids using an EQ plugin - it might just take some finesse. Check out a few videos for ideas.

The problem though is that it sounds harsh.  Even if it needs eq, the vocal should still sound natural.   My vocals, even though I'm standing back about 12" or so, sound like I'm less than an inch from the mic.  

 

7 hours ago, lapasoa said:

What brand of mic you use? What kind of audio interface you use?

I'm using an Se X1S.  I've tried a Rode NT1 and an Audio Technica.  The Se sounds the best.   I use a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 (2nd Gen).

 

2 hours ago, Tezza said:

A small vocal booth draped in blankets is going to sound very boxy. The purpose of the blankets is to make sure they are behind you when you sing into the mic. It's better to have nothing at all behind the mic itself, if by vocals, you mean singing. Singing can be loud and anything you put behind the mic while you sing will rebound back on to the mic with unpredictable but usually horrid results. Making sure that the reflection of sound from behind you when you sing into the mic is deadened is usually enough, it will deaden the sound of the room in general a little as well. If you need to deaden the sound of the room a bit more, cover one of the walls or set up a T stand with something draped over it, away from the mic. If you want air, you need to give the mic air.

Also, anything rebounding on to the mic can cause distortion because the mic diaphragm is being hit by conflicting sound waves from the front (your voice) and the back (whatever you have behind the mic that your voice is bouncing off of).

The pop screen can work as well for plosives but if your mic technique is good and you come at the mic from an angle and can back off/move away etc while you sing, you shouldn't need one. This can only be achieved if you have good isolated monitoring of your voice through headphones.

 

 

I've been experimenting with different things.  I had the mic in the closet with it facing toward the room.   So I was facing toward the back of the closet.  That doesn't work well.  I also had the mic facing the back of the closet, with me facing out toward the room.   That worked better.

My room is 12x12.   Recording in the room sounds horrible.   I put up acoustic panels, but it didn't help the vocals that much.  I had to make a vocal booth in order to get a decent sound.  

Over the weekend I tried upgrading the driver to the Scarlett 2i4.   Now it sounds worse.  It's way more harsh.   I uninstalled the new driver and tried to reinstall the old one, but now it won't work, for whatever reason.   I've tried at least a half dozen times, and the old driver won't install.

So I'm thinking that maybe I should switch to Windows 10.   I read that the new driver for Focusrite sounds fine on Windows 10.

Thanks for everyone's comments!

Edited by greg54
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1 hour ago, greg54 said:

I'm using an Se X1S.  I've tried a Rode NT1 and an Audio Technica.  The Se sounds the best.   I use a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 (2nd Gen).

How does the level look going in ? Make sure the Hallo never turns red and always stays in the green (on the pre amp/input volume on the 212).

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I usually set the Gain to about 11 o'clock.   The halo never gets into the red.    With some projects the vocals are decent.  On other projects the vocals are harsh with lots of mids - with the same settings.  I don't understand it.

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The new driver to the Scarlett 2i4 makes the harshness even worse.   I've been working with it today, and there's just no fixing it.    I tried many times to reinstall the old driver, but it fails to install correctly.

Does everyone like Windows 10?    I may have to switch to that from Windows 7.

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+1 on posting examples of the recorded files. It would be good to have examples of both acceptable and unacceptable recordings.

If you use your BandLab profile to host the audio you can link to the files using a button right here in the message editor. Makes it simple.

I endorse upgrading your system from Windows 7 to Windows 10. More and more software and hardware companies are abandoning development for Windows 7 and compatibility issues will only get worse the longer you wait.

While Cakewalk will install and run in Windows 7, it is specifically optimized to take advantage of features in Windows 10, and is extensively tested in Windows 10.

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I'm not using Bandlab, but Platinum.   I've read multiple people complain about issues with Bandlab, so I've been sticking with Platinum...for now.

I find that the harshness and issues are even worse with the new Focusrite driver.   So perhaps even the old driver is what's causing the problem.

But I think I'll switch to Windows 10.    There's a new interface I would like to get, and it doesn't work with Windows 7.    It's the Solid State Logic SSL2. 

Are there things I have to disable in Windows 10 or do in order to get it to sound its best?

 

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 I remembered that I had a Behringer UMC404HD lying around.   I installed it and ... it works!    And it sounds much better than the Scarlett - not just because there's no harshness, but because the audio is clearer.   So "for now" I'll use this setup.   But I see Windows 10 in my near future.

Thanks, everyone!

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I had an old MAudio Fasttrack that did that. The inputs on the back continued to work fine. The ones that didn't have preamps. But the ones on the front that had preamps went bad. Took a number of years and heavy use. I continued to use it past that point, but the writing was on the wall.

Could be the phantom power. Have you tried using mics that do not require it so that you disable the phantom?

Edited by Gswitz
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